(2007/02) February

I m looking at ON gals clothings......... Wah I wanna faint already.. feel like buying something bt dare nt even login to my acct, if nt I will add & add into my basket le.
 


Catz, tat serious? Oh bt my sis has a crooked tooth bt tat was bcos she use to suck thumb....

time is so slow today..........

yeah - ware has everybody gone to....
 
hey girls!

jelly,
You're really something! Went through all that with your hubby when he was a JB auditor. I'm sure he will appreciate all that!
But eh, I'm a bit kaypoh on your romantic story... he was auditor based in JB and you in SG, then how did you guys meet? Was it the same audit firm?

Catz, Ah Ger,
My friend who sucked pacifier will Primary 1... eh, she had very crooked teeth and not just that, it affected her jawline. So now braces won't help even. She saw a doc... have to do orthodentic work to realign her jaw if she wants straight teeth cos her overbite is too much.
 
Re: Pacifiers

only recently when Lil J is growing her pre-molars she is asking for her tu-tu more often other then bedtime

I hope this does not develop to a bad habit...
 
jelly, same here... my hb also weaker in studies than me. then come out to work also lower pay than me...
only now then slightly more than me haha... almost same pay liao... he catch up so fast.
 
jelly, really? my question is so difficult to answer? I save 30% of my monthly pay cos I have this SAYE account with POSB, so it will automatically deduct from the account and park in a separate account. So, I was expecting hb to say something like I say 10 or 20% of my monthly pay loh..but of cos his answer is very vague until i dun know how to figure out..maybe this is his trick
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catz, how come u so sure can live off 1 income? I really have no idea, i think can but my hb dun think so.

Actually to be honest, I do not know the exact amount that my hb earns or how much bonus or savings he had in the bank. We maintained separate bank accounts so never had to ask him. Do you all know how much your hb earns?

ger, got spreadsheet to share or not?? u can take out the contents, i only need the headings for a guide
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SAHM dun necessarily become yellow faced woman right? I think must also park aside some expense for things like monthly facial, haircut etc. If not, hb has change of heart then wife has no career, no money, how to manage??
 
pacificer sucking
these nites qY keep asking for pacificers.. last time i was able to pat his buttocks and he will fall asleep without pacificers in the nite. arrrgghh.. it must be those few days in malaysia when i used the pacificer too often just to shut his mouth up :x

catz
i onli make partial payment. i couldnt locate the email that indicates the shipping.

jas
payment made for ON items. ur r soooOooOoO NicE to wait for ur hb during his poorer days. well at least now he's able to make up to u right? ;) my hb used to earn nearly double than me when i first knew him. but then after that his pay stagnant coz he stayed in the same old company and depended onli on yearly increment.

ah-ger
kekkeke does A looks like u? i still think so leh

consistency in food
hey hey, when u girls give harder consistency food, do u realised it ends up in their shit? coz i tot i saw things like grains of rice and raisins and corn.. does it means the food was not chewed properly and was not digested, so end up in grainy shit?

cut n chew fruits
QY is a lazy boy. he dun like cut apples and pears. he onli like kiwis, mango.. and others soft fruits. i am still steaming apples if i want him to eat apples. fussy boy.
 
catz... dun tell ur hubby ur spreeing loh. I never tell my hubby also. keke...

huskie... hehe... we met thru work, haha... Ya, we were both in one of the big 4 audit firms, same one some more. But his in JB and mine in SG. I audit the holding co account and he did subsidiary account. The rest was history... kekeke...

garfield... yaloh... maybe must change jobs more often then can see our salaries go up faster. Haha...

cherry... i also wanted to open such account lei. But i really lazy and no time to make a trip down to the bank to open such account. But i will transfer the excess i have to a particular account. I tell myself that is for ah-xi so must be more discipline in building up the balance.
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Of cos i know how much my hubby earn and spend! I kept all his particulars including bank statements and cc statements.
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smurfy, my hubby took up the opportunity and that's why his pay over a few years increase so much until now so much more than me. I really stay in this company for too long. But now no company will want me. Sob sob...
 
keke...

i reach home liao...went specially to tempines to buy some cute tee for tyler..muahahha..

hb scolded me for doing boliao stuff...I LOST my house keys!!...but i clearly remember bringing them home from my mum's place on wednesdae...now feel so insecure!!
 
jelly,
sometimes its fated la...

i always tell myself i will NEVER marry someone who's younger than me...NEVER marry someone wif big eyes..NEVER marry someone I need to take care of...end up all opposite..my family & frens objected my marriage,HB's family also not very hopeful abt the knot... mum was unhappy till recent 1, 2 yrs when hb earning more..but well we haf been "contracted" for 5.5yrs liao..muahahha
 
cherry,
i know how much my hb earn..but coz he also haf commission...so hor..sometimes i oso unsure...as for me..ever since i switch to training..he knows exactly wats my pay lor...

hee...quite good ar..at least you guys are "saving"...me & hb cannot do without a job for more than 3 months coz we dun haf savings...

we only haf insurance..i guess...dats saving for our retirement only..

re: pacifier..tyra had it till 2.5yo..no crooked teeth la..
 
jelly, he knows 'cos nowadays DHL will usually make delivery about the time he comes home :p Last time I would hurry up pack everything swee swee before he gets home to freak out :p

cherryale, I know everything about my hubby and we have free access to each other's statements, internet banking etc. That's why I say we used to live off his income ONLY
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babe, oh no... house keys? hope you find it and that it's just misplaced and not lost.

smurfy, mailed you back
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giggler, huskie,
I pay $60 per month for 4 one-hour-long group swimming lessons. About 6 students in a group. Roland himself is Sarah's coach. She started lessons last year September, when she was about 3 1/4 years old. She just turned 4 last week. I think she only just got the coordination thing. Before that, she was all hands and legs. It's a developmental thing lah.
 
hi ladies

i am heading down to animal resort later?

anyone wanna join? my number is eight one two three six six eight nine
 
i was fuming last night when I went to inlaws plc to pick A and maid up. MIL went with sil and bil to see gynae yesterday, she is 5+weeks. then mil said sil told her tat i should send A to childcare earlier instead of 2years old as children tend to fall sick when they first started to attend childcare and by that time, the newborns will be at home and will spread to the newborns. I was VERY VERY offended by this statement. I told mil curtly that its just too bad,second baby always have to bear with this cos the elder sibling is in school and would bring back virus/bacteria etc. ANd I am not about to send A to school before he completes his MMR jab which I only want to give when he turns 2.

I really find it ridiculous, she is only 5+weeks pregnant and already planning this. To be honest, I also dun like that her dog is so close to my kids, but do I ask for them to bring the dog back to their home instead of staying at inlaws plc??

but she will always tell my mil that its good for kids to grow up with dogs to build up immune system. This is nonsense cos if the kid is allegic, this will trigger a whole lot of problems. talking about it still makes me mad. Told hb last night that I was very offended and he agreed that sil is a little too much too early.
 
cherry,

sounds like its for selfish reason dat your SIL wan your MIL to take care of her baby..in any case...by the time her baby is born..A is already 2 and is oredi in childcare yah..

but your baby and hers the "confinement" is very near..i think you muz make neccessary arrangement..juz in case your MIL play you out la..

actually your maid can help out..and you on ML ma..so instead of getting MIL to take care...might as well you take care of them yourself...bonding oso..
 
catz,

i tried finding for 2 days liao...maid tried to find it but cannot find..maybe really lost le...my DBS IB device in wif the keys...haiz...now cannot do anything,,,luckily still got my UOB..
 
babe, oh nooooooo... actually my sis has that singpost keychain.. dunno pay how much but if anybody finds your keys and drops it into any mailbox, the keys will be returned to you. now i'm debating if i should get that 'cos i'm very careless too. you better call up dbs to deactivate your IB token leh.

cherryale, wah your SIL quite one kind har? :p better make your own plans sans MIL for your #2 lor, sounds like there will be a lot of 'sibling' rivalry liao.

ordered 6 pairs of pants for the kids from Jshoppers but er.. all so big :p my vainpot Beth insist on wearing a pair of shorts which make her butt look ultra huge 'cos can stuff 2 chickens inside. ahahhaahaha.. little vainpot.
 
hi ladies

bz friday and sat for me.. went to farmart in the am, animal resort in pm and my grandama plc in late afternoon. now my arms aching.

ah ger,

last time when cherish got only 4 teeth, i cut fruits in slices and let her bite.. i dunno how she does that, but she seems to be able to chew using her gums. with a lazy mum, i guess she learns thr means and ways.

smurfy,

there was once i saw gou qi zi in cherish poo.. i tot she passed out blood.. heehee..cherish hor, even with pacifier, she still can "talk"

Re: savings

my hb pays for almost everything..thats y his saving very empty.. i pay for the internet bills and my own spendings.. the bulk is insurance lor..
 
Babe, what cute T-shirt did you buy for tyler? I want to see!!! Ask Tyler if he took your keys. I lost my IB device the other day and it turned out that Ethan was the culprit... found it in his toy box :p Your hubby is younger than you?! Really can't tell leh... just 1, 2 years kind har?

Jelly, you are lucky to have ILs who appreciates what you did for your hubby. Come to think of it, my MIL has NEVER acknowledged my contribuitions to my hubby's current career. She just conveniently pretends she doesn't know >
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You know ah, that geek of mine graduated 3 years after me leh! After I graduated, he went on to do his honours and accelerated masters. And I did very well during the first few years of my career so I gong gong bought this house jointly with him. He was still a penniless student so I paid the whole 20% downpayment by myself. I was only 25 then so that was like my entire life savings leh! So dumb hor? Next time I must make sure my daughter won't be so foolish (if I get that daughter I am praying for lah). Don't know 100% going to marry that fellow or not already co-own a property with him when I was the one who paid for it. Then ah, that bloke ah, upon working for 8 months drop another bomb on me - wanted to break his bond! Studied for soooo many years, his scholarship not cheap leh! So again, no choice, took out my newly re-charged life savings to pay for his bond lor. I'm glad that investment paid off eventually and his company is doing quite ok now. But whenever his mum or family say things like, "wah, you very good life hor, don't need to work still got maid to serve you..." I really want to tell them, "Ooi! it's payback hor!" :D

Catz, been wanting to ask you... I remembered you couldn't stomach your folic acid when you were pregnant with beth right? How long did you skip it for? I haven't been taking my folic acid recently either due to my bad MS too leh...
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Cherry ah, your SIL just 5 weeks only already chu1 zhao1 liow... I think you better be prepared for a lot more "patterns" in future man...
 
hubby burning midnight oil, doing some papers so I'm up too.. heh.

Winnie, omg, you paid the downpayment? Actually, my parents helped us out with the downpayment on our first apartment and I dumped in all my savings too. But then again, so did he so I'm ok with that. Can't believe he broke his scholarship bond! My hubby's bond stands at $300k now, no way of breaking it :p Yup, I didn't take the Duphaston and folic acid and calcium supplements for practically until 5 months pregnant leh. *guilty guilty* Even after the MS had passed, I just wasn't in the habit of taking lor
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winnie, perhaps u must refresh your inlaws' memory about your contributions. I dun have such contributions so I got nothing to say. The 20% for my current plc was partially paid by inlaws as we were also 25/26 and got no savings. We said we wanted to pay back but havent quite paid in full. Think todate, at most paid them about 25k, we also never keep track. today I am going to write a cheque to pay them another 20k. Then maybe another 20k end of the year. This will end my debt to them.

my sil is this kind of person, remember i said b4 they wanted mil to keep their room for them so that they can stay over when they have baby. Do you know when she told mil this?? She said this once she knew I was pregnant with A!! that time she has just married my bil. They conveniently forgot that the room they were occupying was my hb and my room before we moved out!!! She definitely need my mil to look after her baby cos her mum cant do it.

babe, that is precisely the problem, assuming her edd is in feb, when her baby is borned A will go to childcare, so the initial few mths to her is the worst cos kids will typically fall ill, so she will like A to go to childcare like now to build up immune system. Honestly kids fall sick in childcare all the time, even if I send A to school now, there is no guarantee that he will not fall ill when the newborns are out. Our confinement will be about 1 mth apart lah.

winnie, yesterday I saw gynae, I think #2 is boy cos we can see something between the legs. I am ok but hb is a little more inclined to girl. So wish you luck to get a girl!!
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My edd is likely to be early jan cos from the size of my baby he is 11weeks already. I cant quite remember the exact date of LMP. So, if this time again early, potentially I will have dec 08 baby.

I am also guilty of not taking folic. My gynae just gave me the iron and calcium pills, but they are so huge, the look of it already puts me off
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catz, my mil has 3 sons, so all the other women in the family are either DILs or maids
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hey anyone doing spree on gap or ON? I need to get some maternity stuff
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hint hint CATZ???
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I think in my life I have two major complains - sil/bil and my maid. My maid is getting really irritating. First, she said the curtain tie-back flew out of the windows cos it was loose, so now she has to use string to tie the curtain cos we no longer has anything to tieback which looks super awful. Then, she told hb, one of his new shirt tore when she tried to wash it. Today is the last straw, I wanted to bring A out for breakfast and it was drizzling, so I asked her to get me a red Guess cap that hb likes A to wear, she said she last saw the cap in our OLD car which has been sold about 3 months ago. She said dun know where is the cap now. My goodness, if its in the car, shouldnt she bring it up to the house, instead of leaving it in the car? hb told me must scold her but I really dun know how to scold. In the end, just told her to find in mil's plc to see if we have left it there
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later will go to forum to see whether they still carry that cap in the guess shop. waste my money, to think I have to waste another 800+ to do her passport and workpermit tomorrow, urrgh....

i wish I can ask my mum to look after my kids and then get another maid to help out after I deliver #2. But I am worried my mum will say yes then play me out later.
 
babe, i also 'lost' my dbs device and hp before. end up, its A who has hidden them in the kitchen cabinets. For confinement, i dun really need MIL to help, maybe just need to do marketing for me. That's why i need CL loh.
 
cherry, sorry, promised hubby no more sprees.. but heh, I'm doing a Maidenform one now 'cos I desperately need strapless bras
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Anyone?
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Eh your maid so troublesome ah? I think hor, your maid is very good at making up stories. Why you afraid that your mom will play you out har?
 
catz, no prob, dun want your hb to show u 'black' face too
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or worse 'scold' me when i go to your plc to pick up stuff
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no need bras for me for a long while.

my maid is experienced maid mah, of cos clever lah. As for my mum, she is nice to me but she has not taken care of kids for super long already, i think she cant cope. Even with A at their plc on sat night when we go back for dinner, she said she has no energy to keep up with him, so if it is from Mon to Fri, I think she will surrender.
 
cherry, my husband won't scold my spreeists .. 'cos I'm the one who will kena
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Eeks, experienced maids got so many pattern, but inexperienced ones can be so gong. Tough call.
 
HEhe..I didnt take my pills too..only folic faithfully..the rest like iron and fish oil hardly..only when I remember which was say few days once..only at 7months when gynae discovered my RBC was low..the kena scolding, then start taking lor.

Cherry..Boy also good lah..A got friend to play rough with haha..I dont mind having another boy too..but told my hb then I want to try for another one cos I want a girl too! IN fact if I can, I want a few girls..hehehe!

My SIL jus announced they bought a terraced house single-storey at thomson..sold their flat in punggol..we didnt realise they got that much $$$..so hb said since they can afford to buy private property must help more with his parents' allowance then. Anyway, they asking my in laws to move in with them..and rent out the bishan flat..good idea..but think my MIL kena "bond"..if my SIL dont get maid or part-time help, she'll have to do all the housework for them..plus maybe in future kena take care of my SIL's baby too.

SAHMs' gathering.
Shall we meet next week on Tuesday? For lunch 12plus-1:30pm? Or u mummies prefer tea 2:30-3pm kind of timing? Since there are not many of us we try to find a date where all of us are free ok?

PVL..did u mention a time or day that not so convenient for u?
 
uurrgghhh.... first day of work today after a super long break.... dun like school hols cos it really break the momentum...

hope u gals have a good week ahead
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charis,
Are you talking about tomorrow? That's fine. I can make it tomorrow. Lunch is better cos the kids sleep after lunch, and Sarah has swimming later in the afternoon. This week I'm ok for other days too. We're off to Camerons next week.
 
Morning mummies...

Last sat my elder sis and BIL brought me and ah-xi to the Bollywood and Hay dairy farm for a tour. Wasei... The weather was super hot on Sat!!! Luckily i got applied sun lotion all over ah-xi and brought her hat. Else later she becomes oh oh sure will kena scolding from her daddy. Overall, we have a good time there. But bollywood charge $2 per adult (kids below 12 is free) and we didn't see much fruits on the trees. Hay dairy farm is more worth to go. So many species of goats... My timid ah-xi a bit scared of the goats and dare not get close to them, but she got waive bye bye to the goats. Haha...

Then yday my nice sis and BIl drove us to orchard to shop. They super nice lah, purposely went wif me so that they can take care of ah-xi and helped me carry the baby bag when i shopped. But still cldn't find the flat-sole working shoes for myself, so am still wearing the high heels. Hopefully this coming weekend can find in JB.

Babe... alamak, lost house key. Maybe u just misplaced it? Tried search thru ur pockets and bags, and corner of the car... Yaya... it's all fated... hehe...
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Catz... i always asked the delivery to be sent to my office, plus hubby always not around, so more "convenient" for me to do sprees without his knowledge. Haha...

pvl, i hope my gal will slowly overcome her fear on water so tat i can bring her to swimming classes as well. But she seems to inherit the fear of water from me lei... But small improvement on her. Now she is ok and love shower!
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cherry.... ur sil is plain selfish! Buay tahan!!!

Haha... Winnie, i am another dummo. We bot our JB house when we were together for only 6 months. We borrowed the first 10% instalment from his mum (fully repaid long time ago), and i paid almost 100% of the renovation of the house. Then when we bot this sg house, i also used up all my savings and CPF, borrowed from my sisters and mum and for the first year, all the monthly instalment is from my CPF acc alone as he has very minimum CPF at that time. Thank god we have managed to repay all to my sis and mum within 1 year. Maybe i shd really quit this time and live on him liao. Haha...

But now u are good wat... U are a SAHM and u hubby 100% support u rite? Most important is he appreciate wat u have done...

Catz... u are doing spree on maidenform? Let me check wif my sis. She is beoing maidenform bras too...
 
chocbabe, I was just laughing at my teacher friend 'cos I never knew teachers dreaded first day at school too. Hehe.

jelly, yes Maidenform
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Hope to order tonight.. hurry hurry! For flat-soled shoes, try Substance at Wheelock and Pazzion? They have good ones. Very nice of your elder sis and BIL.
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PVL, you MUST do the butterfly garden at Camerons.. actually except for the Boh Tea plantation, most attractions are really quick to zip through. Driving into the tea plantation is tricky.. very very tricky.

Charis, wah your SIL is loaded!
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Eh this week no good for me leh.. but next week PVL isn't around..
 
cherry, yr sil abit like my own sis... tat time she also told my mum to "keep/bar" me in my mum bedroom for the entire cf mth! can u imagine tat? I ask my mum y? she say my sis say scare i "polute"... i also v offended. when she has her son n stay at my mum place for tat mth, i also never restrict her movements. tat time I still not married.

i only take calcium pill... i dun like iron pills. so i try to eat more leafy veg n liver.

btw, my auntie told me boy and gal might not play together as toys diff... but anyway, i stoppin at 2 liao...

arggh... tokin abt maid, the insurance thingy... again not sorted! seem like they increase the premium on tat v mth i renew... $$$ again... so need to top again. so sian... never ending...

n my this maid complain to my mil tat cf lady earning so much more than her but she can look after new born too. employ another assistant for her she also complain!
 
morning to all........

Cherry, I'll send u a blank template via email shortly....

Cherry, those haircut facial stuff I nv cater in. if like tat then bcme daily expense sheet liao. Those I consider under misc. So if say tis mth nv use then nx mth u hv more $$ lor. I incl those more deasible ones........

things like I go watsons buy stuff cost $50 & etc I classify them under my misc or credit charges.
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sahms,
Since Catz can't make it this week, and I can't make it next week, then looks like it might have to be week after next
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. Maybe we should arrange early so as to avoid disappointment. Anyhow, from week after next, Wednesday is not so good for me cos it's my marketing day and Sarah has gym at 2.30. Mondays my PT cleaner comes. So best is Tues, Thurs or Fri.

Catz,
Which Boh plantation did you go to? There are two right? Which strawberry farm did you go to that you had to climb a lot?
 
Hey PVL, OK I went to the new Boh at Sungai Palas.. it's lovely but eek, the drive was so ultra scary and nailbiting. Strawberry farm - Kok Lim.. so avoid that one
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My thighs are still wobbly just thinkinga bout it!

SAHM outing - week after on Tues?
 
Catz ah... my sis said she not able to find maidenform counter at shopping centre so not sure of the size to order. So will skip for this time. Sorrrie!!!

Thanks thanks for the info on the flat-sole shoes! Actually i am looking for a bit of height but wider sole kind, a bit like platform shoes but more formal as not nice to wear too casual for meetings...

So busy today.... so looking forward to my hubby back from his trip this wed... He said will bring me to eat sashimi!!! I have craving for sashimi!!!!
 
SAHM gathering..
Ok let's make it Tues 8 July 12:30pm ok? May I suggest city hall area? Cos its central and convenient by mrt.
Cafe Cartel set lunches at $9.80 nett. So does Swensens..but price varies. We can meet at Marina Square.
Pls put names here..

1. Charis with Yael


Catz..Haha..ya lah they both teachers..so I think stable jobs can buy private property..but the terrace house very small..smaller than our 4 room flat here in Pasir Ris can u imagine..5 ppl going to live there plus a dog!

Jelly..Not good idea to eat sashimi right for preggies? Maybe jus a little tiny bit..if really must.
 
garfield, i thot preggie cant take liver as it has high concentration of Vit A? Try to avoid eating too much. U mean own sis also can be so calculative??

i just settled my maid stuff today, spent more than half a day so end up i got to take 1 day leave. for the accident insurance, medical insurance, security deposit I took a package wit AXA, chose the cheapest I thnk its $192.

Yesterday was super eventful. Hb scolded maid big time for some silly mistake that she did. Then she said sorry and told me she want to go back home (home country). Then hb straightaway said ok, u want to go home, i send u home tomorrow...then we went inlaws plc, mil talked to maid, and her maid also talked to maid. So, originally, we planned that since she wants to go, we will go and get new maid today and not do her passport and workpermit already. Then she changed her mind last night, said she was very sorry, so i took the opportunity to do performance appraisal with her. Told her these are her areas of improvements but I will like her to stay if she is willing to stay, but I will NOT beg her to stay. So drama...really man, having maid is like having another set of problems.

I gave fil the cheque today, although poorer but I am happier. it is never a nice feeling to owe money. My next target after repaying them will be to repay my housing loan. Hopefully we can fully redeem the house before we move to another place.

jelly, u making me crave for sashimi, yummy, i especially love it with lots and lots of wasabi
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Your sis is really so nice to u.

for shoes, I have bought 3 pairs from pedder red as they were having sale.As vip, i get additional 10%. I bought 1 pair of platform black, and two flat soles. After discount, I think I paid 200+. Not sure the sale is still now, you can check it out. They have 1 in Taka beside kino bookstore and another at Vivocity beside Tangs.

I have told myself, I shall not be petty towards sil, actually i am getting my dvd on the birth process back from my friend and buying some pregnancy books for her to read up. Maybe she is young and insecure so that's why she needed to 'chop' certain things for herself. Since we are older, then just let her be loh. At the end of the day, I will also stick to what I think is good for my son
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ger, thanks, u send to my office email??

charis, if I am not so old, I will prob try #3 for a girl
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actually having A made me change my mind about having kids. I used to be not very into kids. Told hb at most 1 kid, then with A I find that it makes our home so much livelier. So, I really like him to have a playmate. hb also agree to have #3 if we really want. Will see how after we have #2.

I am temporarily calling my #2 Russell. This will be his middle name
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Where I got this inspiration, its from the Air Supply concert
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Both of them have russell in their names!

Jelly, forgot to update u, hb and I truly enjoyed the concert. There were also a lot of couples there and I think they also felt the same way, the songs were good reminders of when we were young
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I am sure they will come to Singapore again and hopefully next time u and hb
can attend the concert
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cherry, i still here... guess everyone partyin liao ah... ;p

i eat liver but not too much too.

yrs confirm boy? u r onz... for me, i think 2 just nice... hb also like to have no 3... but i no guts n think i dun have time for all 3?
 
i finally opened the CNY angpows that were given to A. Going to bank into his account this week plus those angpows received for his 1st birthday
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i am really quite behind in doing all these stuff, thanks to ah ger's spreadsheet, gave me inspiration
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monday everyone goes home early?? anyway i have been leaving office pretty early too nowadays. Told hb I am proactively cutting back on work, haha

garfield, not confirm but to me its almost 100%, cos if can see means boy mah, unless see wrongly. But hb still hopeful. you are so lucky, got mei mei
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#3 for me is something that i will keep it open, who knows after #2, I will change my mind cos cant cope with 2 monkeys running around the house
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