Support group - Miscarriages

Hi Hi!
Was away for work in Boston for 5 days so had a lot of catch up reading to do. AF came again in the midst so I am really disappointed again. And guess what happened this morning???!!!!

This chap from my team was caught by co security having "intimate relations" with a new (and very young)secretary by the cctv camera!!!! Whole department in big hoo-haa. What got me really angry was that his wife of > 6 years had just suffered a m/c in her 4th month last X'mas. And they already have another child! What a b*****d! My mate from the trading floor even called me 3 times to ask for juicy details just so he can "entertain" his desk.

I feel like asking the NHS to offer free chemical castration services for men like these.
 


Linda,Good to hear from u again. Guess Tory is short for "Vic - tory" yeah? Wow, are u ttcing for 2nd bb already? I have some friends who will turn pale at the thought of another bb.

Hi Wendyl, very sorry to hear about u. Take care yeah? It's very normal to think that u're okay, only to start a crying spell a couple of weeks later. Even now I get very teary on some bad days but I'd tell myself to cry out the pain so I will be ready for a new bb.
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Hi Tiny & millie,
I'm still around! Dun forget me! Anyway, back to ur qns, (and based on the countless books I've read) it is better to abstain for a few days - not too many, around 4/5??, before ovulation day so that the sperm is at its most potent.
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Then because the egg that is released has a shelf life of only 24 hrs, we should start BD 1 day before OD and continue daily for up to 4 days. Sounds easy enough but is tremendously difficult to put into practice! How to catch OD 100% accurately? How to deal with amorous husbands in the meanwhile???

And thanks for the bb dust, Tears. Just thinking, I was actually away in the US at that time so did it reach me or was it blown away by the British storms?

Hi Curly, I know Peter Chew! All the women in my family have been going to him so I guess he must be very good. He also helped my cousin a lot when she m/c one of the twin she was carrying.
 
snuffles, what a jerk!! He shd be shot. And the poor wife ...

So, at least someone know Peter Chew. I had never heard of him until I attend one of this talks. He also referred me to his counsellor after I had my m/c.
 
Hi ladies!

Hi Millie, forgetmenot
Wow.. you all sure move fast and before most of you misunderstand me, I meant TINY's boy or girl to play with Tory... and NOT my own!!! Kekekkeek... I am not that brave! Although I think that pregnancy and birth was fun, I certainly refused to commit myself for another one soon... in fact NO MORE!!! I wouldn't mind if I carry and give birth to the baby and give it to someone....

Hi Snuffles
Well... Men are mostly controlled by their "little heads" instead of their main one on top. In such cases, we will never know the whole story behind the man's infidelity. But then again, it is sure a juicy way to start a Friday! I wonder how wld the couple face the entire work team... Will they be asked to leave?

Tory comes from my fave series of story books...Victoria is the character in my fave book - she's also called Tory in there, then if I had another girl, she will be named Elizabeth, the next will be Alexandra.
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As to how to deal with amorous husbands in the meanwhile...hehehehe... My advise is take the WHOLE package.... Although it has scientific reasons to believe that abstaining might do the trick but I think trying more frequently helps a great deal too!
Hi Tears
*Linda wearing square hat*
Wow... You make me sound as if I got my degree in flying colours.
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I sure hope all of you will graduate fm this thread too... In fact, I myself get so excited when one of you get pregnant cos I can remember the joy and fears that comes with it. But we all here to learn and grow with each other. Dun think you have "failed" cos you DID NOT.
 
hello, have a question regarding follow up with gynae after miscarriage. What kind of check-up do they perform? Do they do a scan to see if womb has healed properly? Will they tell u what could have gone wrong,or is it just a routine 5 min thing? Me asking because not sure what to expect, especially from a gvt hospital... thanks
 
Hmmm...Linda you so 'wei da' ah! Want to help be surrogate mother for me??
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If I can't get pregnant by the end of the year, you help me lah! Hee hee..Looks like you're into old English names...So you will have a Lizzy and Alex I guess?

Dovetail, are u referring to a natural m/c or missed abortion where D&C had to be performed? My gynae scanned me about 6 wks post D&C to check that the uterus had gone back to normal size and that the 'stuff' had been cleared out. I'm sure they do that too in a govt hospital.
 
Linda, I also want!!! Can I stand in queue behind Tiny?

It was actually Thursday over here when I found out. I had been away so my PA literally screamed her head off when she saw me coming in the morning. Said it happened on Monday evening down by the basement where the printroom toilets are. The secretary in question is not from my team, I have never spoken to her before so not sure what will happen to her. The jerk from my team had been seconded to another deak temporarily (some Chinese wall requirement by the lawyers) where he met her. He is now "suspended", pending investigation of misconduct. Wah! My boss is in an uproar man... I think that secretly he is jealous because he is so hen-pecked!
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Hi dovetail, I had a natural m/c and had a scan on the day itself. Subsequently, my GP did not perform another scan but only probbed my tummy to check for discomfort and hardness.
 
hi, thanks for all your replies. Mine was d & c, going back for follow-up in two weeks time. actually not sure whether to go back to kk, or find a private gynae, coz didn't like the service at kk. but all my records are with hospital. did anyone follow-up with a different doctor from the one who did d&c?
 
Hi all!

I am back from Italy! I am glad to report to that I have done my 'work' so now waiting for fate to determine if I brought back any Italian souvinirs.
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I am not too optimistic though...as I don't have much EWCM this month.. but I attributed it to the cold weather in Italy!
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fingers crossed!

Wendyl, read about your loss in the other thread and glad to see you join us. Hope you find support from all the gals here.

Dovetail, sorry to hear about your loss as well. Hope you get well soon.

Linda, very good to see you back and posting. You must be back at work already? I am still a little jetlag and I can't seem to type properly!

snuffles, wow, so juicy news.. although I agree he is such a b*****d! but I really think it is such great tabloid material! hahaha!

Ok, back to clearing email. Chat later!

folic
 
Dovetail, so sorry to hear about your loss! Hope u r getting better! Do take care of yourself, ok. U r with KK too? Did u see any specific doc?

Dun think it will be the D/C doctor that u will be seeing, unless that was ur selected gynae? Till now, i also dun noe the name of the doc whom did the D/C.

Agreed that KK svcs was very bad too... i was supposed to go back for follow-up D/C 6 weeks later, which will be this coming Wed. Dun noe if i wanna go... Felt that it is a waste of time and money.

Snuffles, oh, so u not in UK that time when i sent the baby dust?? Nevermind, as long as you r back in UK, the Baby Dust shld be there waiting for you!!
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Hi Tears,

nope, didn't ask for any gynae because I didn't intend to go there actually. Was in midst of looking for recommended gynae and only went because I needed a second opinion. Saw three or four different doctors when I was there and oso feel waste of time and money to go back to kk... But i want to know what happened and whether I've healed physically or not lei..still wondering what could have caused baby to stop growing and if I'm fit enough to try again soon.
 
Hi snuffles and tiny,
heheheheh... Honestly I dun mind. But hor, I rather you two have them yourselves!
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You will soon, dun worry.

Hi Dovetail,
Gynaes normally after one m/c will tell you not to worry and they won't run any checks on you. Cos out of all pregnancies, up to 35% m/c within the first trimester. Sad to say, it is believed to be quite "common". Like mine, nothing could be explained. Nothing we can do to ensure nothing like that didn't happened. Medically, they cannot do anything for me. When my gynae told me that, I was devasted. NO ANSWERS!!! But then again, it is also the truth.

They will prob do an ultrasound for you to check everything inside is fine. And run some answers to your questions like when to try again, what to do for your next pregnancy. Think abt what you wish to know and have them answered. Personally, I think you shld go back to your current gynae for the post check. After all clear been given and you are TTC-ing, then seek another gynae you are comfortable with.

Hi folic,
Yah back at work liao... So siaz....

Hi Aquarius
Thanks for asking abt me. We are doing well.
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hi dovetail, tails,
i did not go for the follow-up checkup with KK too. But it wasn't becoz of the service la, i think its just not feeling like going back.

linda,
hehe think you too busy with tory already. i did share with you my preggy about the time when you were going to give birth. keke i remember you went to simalu to pray for smooth delivery too and promise to include me in your prayers...keke..must thank you!! all is fine till now la....but still full of fear..
 
Linda, no, i dun think KK will do an ultra-scan... Base on my last visit back to KK for follow-up/pain on the bleeding after washing, the doc did stated that no scan was scheduled for my post washing follow-up.

Dovetail, not sure if yours have as your followup was just 2 weeks later while mine was given 6 wks later. By the way, do u mind sharing with us what happen? How are you feeling now?

I do understand the feeling of wanting to know why... i felt so too.... Now i was jus debating if i shld need to go back KK this comin Wed.... There is really no point if the doc just wanted to check on me by his naked eye. Moreover, the waiting time is usually 1.5hrs with no satisfaction results!
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Hi tears,

I'm from the abortion thread. Thank you for your support.
May I know how much does KK charge for each visit? Thanks.
 
Yes Baby Mandy, i can still remember you. It was abt 2 mths since that happened right? How are you feeling? I do hope that you are better and eating more nutritious food.
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Are you intending to go KK? Although i had lots of bad bad comments abt KK due to my very heartaching experience, but there are just some good docs there.

For me, at that point of time, i was thinkin of choosin a doc after 16wks! Also, KK being specialise in this, i scared of any complication. But my bb din stay with me for that long....
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As i went to polyclinic and get a refferal letter, no selection of doc. Per consultation visit is $20.00 excluding scanning, test, etc. Every time u go (unless emergency), there will be a urine routine check on sugar level which is $7. If an ultrascan is done, it is only $10. it is quite cheap, but every visit, the waiting time is min 1.5hrs. I was in KK for almost 5hrs that time during my 1st visit!!
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I really dun mind waiting as long as my BB is okay, but.... Guess subsidized rate = sub-standard service too

If u would like to chk normal rate, then i need to go home to look at the brochure i took... Not sure if it is still there... Will go back and chk!
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Yes, about 7 weeks now. My period just came last week
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No, I'm not intending to go to KK but I was curious to know the charges. But after comparing govt & pte, pte really costs a lot more
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My gynae is from Gleneagles, though she is a bit ex but she is very good & caring. While I was in the hospital, she checked on me frequently even at 12 midnight. I could see her hair was still wet. She must have just taken her shower at home & rushed to hospital & checked on me. I like her a lot! She was the one who delivered my first baby.
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Hi Tears,
I forgot to say thank you for the information <font color="ff0000">paiseh</font>
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Arigato.

I feel much better now and I got to be strong or my family would be worried of me. This does not applied to me only but to all of you who are here, we have to be strong and positive
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Gambate kudasai!!
 
dovetail, sorry to read abt ur loss. well, i wld suggest u see a private gynae for a checkup esp if you hv bad service experience at kk. my gynae did a ultrascan for me abt 2 wks after d&amp;c to make sure that the uterus has contracted well and that all is well. rest well!

linda, i am also in line for you to help me in carrying baby. must be tiring for you now to go back to work and handle tory at the same time.

folic, welcome back! hope that the air and atmosphere in tuscany has created wonders for you.
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shall wait for your update.
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snuffles, welcome back too! what a scandalous news you have to share with us! ha....i hv been ttc-ing on alternate days now. so, if no gd news this cycle, shall try your method. but if everyday, don't know if my hubby can tahan!

bebechic, be positive and waiting for you to share the story of birth of your baby!
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Have been reading the thread and realised that there are a lot of bad experiences with KK. Is that true? I'm just asking in advance in case I should decide to return to S'pore for my bb (when i get preg.)Which hospitals are recommended?

Heard that jerk from team has been "counselled" to leave firm but has flatly refused. Wonder what will happen? The new sec is on a temp basis anyway so she has left. Now her employee pass pic is circulating the department. Poor thing! Team has decided not to reveal news to jerk's wife.

Hey millie, let me know if the method works for u. Agree that it's very shiong! But that's when our hubbies' manhood is put to the test.
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Linda, how do u cope with separation anxiety? Or are u simply glad to be away for a couple of hrs each day?

Folic, hubby said they had some major thunderstorms last week over the continent cos' of low pressure. Guess the trip must have been wet? Never mind, cold weather is supposed to stimulate more sperm production and chances of bb boys are higher!
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How abt giving ur bb a macho Italian name?
 
Hi BabyMandy,

welcome to the thread! Glad to hear that your menses is here.
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Take care and hope you are ready to try again soon! btw, can I ask who is your gynae is Gleneagles? My gynae was from there too.

Millie, thanks for the welcome back. I also hope that this is my month!
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snuffles, yeah, it was quite rainy last week. It was still ok at the tuscany, just light drizzle but in Rome, it was raining quite heavily at some point. My hair was all wet when I stood at the bus stop waiting for a bus. Luckily never catch cold! I hope your theory is right about sperm production! :D I certainly need lots of that! But I secretly wish for a baby gal this time round though
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folic
 
baby mandy,
i used to see KK doctors and now i am seeing private...and its cheaper!! suprisingly. i spent about $65+ every visit in KK because i choose a gynae and he is a consultant. if you opt for a specialist it will probably be $45+ per visit. now i am seeing an old gynae outside previously from KK. his charges are less than $45 inclusive of ultrasound and vit, supplements..etc

millie,
i am trying to stay positive although its difficult. am counting down to the day that i can share my birth story like helen and linda too!!

folic,
bb gals are cute!! i hope you will strike one soon!! me having a gal now, but hubby pref a boy..
 
Hi Folic,
Thank you. Yes, I'm taking care of myself, eat a lot of "po" also
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. So far I've drunk 21/2 bottle of DOM.

I hope to hear good news from you soon
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My gynae is Mary Yang. Consultation is $45, ultrasound scan is $50. So each visit always exceed $100
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Haiz... the terminaton cost more than having a baby...

bebechic,
U r so lucky to find an experienced yet affordable gynae
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Although Mary is a bit ex, she is really good and I've confidence in her. Besides, i prefer a female gynae. Dunno how to face a male gynae
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Hi snuffles,
Choice of hospitals is a second choice...more imptly you shld be concern over choice of gynae lor... Most of us here just follow wherever our gynae does all his/her deliveries.
As for separation anxiety, hehehhe... first day I cried on leaving...(in fact I cried already the night b4 I start work and kept kissing her non stop) but after 3 days, it was alright lah... In fact kind of feel "normal" and not like a milk-making &amp; diaper-changing machine....
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Hi bebechic,
DID I???? Aiyoh... nowadays VERY forgetful.... Must be Tory's fault...
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So glad for you... Enjoy yourself now and take care yah??? Girls are more fun to dress up..Tory has so many dresses and cute overalls that I prob shld have another 3 more girls to wear them all.

Hi Millie,
You wanna queue also ah?? hahhaah... Like I have said, I rather you yourself experience the joy and I am SURE you will have a chance to soon!!! Just stay positive. How's TTC-ing?

Hi Tears,
OIC...I didn't know KK don't do ultrasound on the post d&amp;c checkup. I had mine like 2 weeks after d&amp;c. Gynae did ultrasound and found a cyst inside which he says is normal in women who just gave birth or had a d&amp;c. Then he checked if inside was clear.... Supposed to go back to him after 3 mths again (for what I cannot remember) but cos I got pregnant a mth later &amp; changed gynae.
 
Mandy, i forget to bring the charges and so i search from KK website. This is the breakdown:-

<u>Outpatient Fee Scheme</u>
Private * - P
Refers to select a specific specialist; is a non-resident or foreigner; self refers or is referred by a private practitioner or hospital, or a government or restructured hospital to a named specialist.

Subsidised * - S
Refer to Subsidised referral applies if the patient is referred by a government polyclinic

1st Consultation
- Specialist
P: $55.60 S: $20

- Consultant
P: $65.70 S: $20

- Senior Consultant
P: $80.80 S: $20

Repeat Consultation
- Specialist
P: $36.40 S: $20

- Consultant
P: $46.50 S: $20

- Senior Consultant
P: $56.60 S: $20

X-Ray, Laboratory &amp; Miscellaneous Specialised Investigations
P: $7.10 - $1,905.20
S: 35% of Class A fees (subject to a min of $7 per investigation and a max of $85 per group of investigation per attendance)

Surgical Operation Fee(per procedure)#
P: $395.50 - $7,562.50
S: $137 - $540

Day Surgery Bed Charges
P: $101 S: $21

Prescription
P: At full cost, with no maximum
S: $1.40 per item per week

So Mandy, it is only cheap if you do not choose doc! Like me, before i can convert to private patient, my BB gone.... Somehow, i still feel that if i will to go to another doc, my BB might still be with me!
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Linda,

Just to clarify, yours was a private gynae is it? sorry,so many posts, getting a bit confused!
hmmm, if KK's practice is not to do ultrascan, then I'll go to a private gynae. I don't c how doctor can make sure everything's ok if he just ask questions.. My experience at KK wasn't great even though I was under the private category because I walked into 24 hr clinic without referral. Besides paying the private rate, spent a lot of time waiting and seeing different doctors all the time. Had to have blood test n ultrasound to check if everything ok, and everytime, a different doctor reviewed the results. guess it's because I didn't specify a particular gynae but still, they just pass the medical records to whoever's available. Then when I was admitted for d&amp;c, couldn't confirm what time I would be operated on. Was without food and drink for 11 hrs that day, and couldn't even be fed via drip coz trainee doctor inserted needle 3 times and still couldn't find a vein to inset needle! very tramautised already, finally operated on after waiting for 7 hours, but only because hubby made noise. The last straw came when they forgot about my breakfast the next morning! Could be just me, others may have better luck, i don't know, but I know I won't want to go back there again if I can help it!
 
Hi Dovetail,

The gynae who did my d&amp;c is a pte one. Think KKH don't do scans thruout pregnancy also...only when there is a need to do then they do for eg, detail scan... Pte gynaes scan each time you go to them. I think that's the diff. My cousin also get terrible treatment from a gynae in KKH. hink it is not the hospital problem... it is the gynae's.
The one I saw for d&amp;c is in yishun. The one I saw for Tory is Dr Kowa Nam Sing at Mt E. if you need contacts let me know.
 
Hi Babymandy,

I heard about Dr Mary Yang. She is supposed to back up my gynae Dr Tanny Chan, when she goes on holiday.
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I know what you mean.. I spent a bomb last year when I lost my baby as well! I think I will change dr for the next preg though.. cos my hubby doesn't feel good going back to Dr Chan and Gleneagles. Tough decisions, cos I liked both the dr and the hospital! Oh well, I will take it one step at a time!

Actually, I think your situation is quite similar to Wendyl (if I remember correctly). It must be tough to make such decisions! *BIG BIG HUGS*

Java, you back from Langkawi yet?

Linda, so funny to read about your separation anxiety!
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Like drama - cry the nite b4
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But I can imagine how you must have felt!


folic
 
How is everyone doing?

I just got back from a holiday... was great... but the emptiness somehow set in after I got back home... and getting teary easily again.

Saw my gynae today and he confirmed that everything is ok. We did ask him about when we can try again (though he did mention last time that we need to wait for 3 months after the D&amp;C) and he told us that theoretically it is 3 months but he doesn't see a problem even if I conceive before the 3 months is up.

Tears... please do not blame yourself for what has happened. Quoting an article which I read recently "Its nature's way of making sure that when you do have a baby, it has the best chance for all of its life". But for now maybe you would like to find out more about other gynaes around... and go with one that you are comfortable with.

Folic... maybe you would like to discuss with your hubby and let him know that you are comfortable with the Dr. I know memories will surface when you re-visit the same doc but if you feel he is good I think it will be a waste. Personally I find that the gynae is like a friend who will be there to see you through the whole pregnancy and delivery (and maybe for the next few babies that you are going to have)... the level of trust and comfort must be there. I will stick to the one that I have because he is experienced, have heard lots of good review from others and he is like a father who is patient and understanding.

Just read this article from another site... and would like to share it with everyone.

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Fourteen years ago I gave birth to a baby girl. Four hours later she died because of an internal malformation that was undetectable during my pregnancy. During my short hospital stay, nurses and doctors seemed to avoid me and my questions. What they did say was about the same as what my friends and family were saying. "You're young. You'll have other babies. Try to forget."

I didn't want any other baby; I wanted that one! Forget? How could I forget? Instead I was overwhelmed with crushing, breathtaking grief. I remember how empty I felt the day I left the hospital...an empty womb and empty arms. I never really knew her but I missed her and ached for her so desperately.

Soon after I returned home, everyone acted as if they had already forgotten her, as if they expected me to also. Someone had removed all the baby items I had acquired before coming home, hoping to spare me the pain. Instead, it felt like a further denial of her existence. When I tried to talk about her everyone became very quiet, or changed the subject, or left the room. Friends were very careful not to say anything that might remind me of my experience. Baby shower invitations didn't come in the mail. Birth announcements didn't come in the mail. Many stayed away because they simply did not know what to say. My husband had three days to "get over it" before he was expected back at work. The world kept on spinning as if nothing had happened. I remember thinking that I must have lost my mind.

I thought that if my baby had lived for a while, if people had gotten to know and love her, maybe then I would have been given the affirmation to grieve the way I needed to. But I was the only one with any memory of her, the only one who had the chance to love her. I had no one to share that with, not even my husband. Most of his grief was for me and for the dreams we had shared for this child. I felt all alone as I began my mourning.

Over the years, after much healing, I have had the opportunity to speak with other parents who have had experiences which were similar to mine. As a result of that, and also as a result of my search for answers to all those unanswered questions, I have compiled a list of several "truths and non-truths" concerning the grieving process as it relates to perinatal bereavement.

This is not intended to be the absolute word on the subject, but rather a gauge for the unexpected emotions felt by parents who have suffered this type of loss. Most of the parents I have spoken to agreed that the uncertainty of their grief was frightening and may have been alleviated had they known what to expect.

Friends and family may also benefit from reading this over so they might understand the special kinds of pain and emotions involved in this type of loss and allow them to be expressed.

"THE TRUTH IS..."
The truth ISN'T that you will feel "all better" in a couple of days, or weeks, or even months.


The truth IS that the days will be filled with an unending ache and the nights will feel one million sad years long for a while. Healing is attained only after the slow necessary progression through the stages of grief and mourning.

The truth isn't that a new pregnancy will help you forget.

The truth is that, while thoughts of a new pregnancy soon may provide hope, a lost infant deserves to be mourned just as you would have with anyone you loved. Grieving takes a lot of energy and can be both emotionally and physically draining. This could have an impact upon your health during another pregnancy. While the decision to try again is a very individualized one, being pregnant while still actively grieving is very difficult.

The truth isn't that pills or alcohol will dull the pain.

The truth is that they will merely postpone the reality you must eventually face in order to begin healing. However, if Your doctor feels that medication is necessary to help maintain your health, use it intelligently and according to his/her instructions.
The truth isn't that once this is over your life will be the same.

The truth is that your upside-down world will slowly settle down, hopefully leaving you a more sensitive, compassionate person, better prepared to handle the hard times that everyone must deal with sooner or later. When you consider that you have just experienced one of the worst things that can happen to a family, as you heal you will become aware of how strong you are.

The truth isn't that grieving is morbid, or a sign of weakness or mental instability.

The truth is that grieving is work that must be done. Now is the appropriate time. Allow yourself the time. Feel it, flow with it. Try not to fight it too often. It will get easier if you expect that it is variable, that some days are better than others. Be patient with yourself. There are no short cuts to healing. The active grieving will be over when all the work is done.

The truth isn't that grief is all-consuming.

The truth is that in the midst of the most agonizing time of your life, there will be laughter. Don't feel guilty. Laugh if you want to. Just as you must allow yourself the time to grieve, you must also allow yourself the time to laugh.Viewing laughter as part of the healing process, just as overwhelming sadness is now, will make the pain more bearable.
The truth isn't that one person can bear this alone.

The truth is that while only you can make the choices necessary to return to the mainstream of life a healed person, others in your life are also grieving and are feeling very helpless. As unfair as it may seem, the burden of remaining in contact with family and friends often falls on you. They are afraid to "butt in," or they may be fearful of saying or doing the wrong thing. This makes them feel even more helpless. They need to be told honestly what they can do to help. They don't need to be told, "I'm doing fine" when you're really NOT doing fine. By allowing others to share in your pain and assist you with your needs, you will be comforted and they will feel less helpless.

The truth isn't that God must be punishing you for something.

The truth is that sometimes these things just happen. They have happened to many people before you, and they will happen to many people after you. This was not an act of any God; it was an act of Nature. It isn't fair to blame God, or yourself, or anyone else. Try to understand that it is human nature to look for a place to put the blame, especially when there are so few answers to the question, "Why?" Sometimes there are answers. Most times there are not. Believing that you are being punished will only get in the way of your healing.
The truth isn't that you will be unable to make any choices or decisions during this time.

The truth is that while major decisions, such as moving or changing jobs, are better off being postponed for now, life goes on. It will be difficult, but decisions dealing with the death of your baby (seeing and naming the baby, arranging and/or attending a religious ritual, taking care of the nursery items you have acquired) are all choices you can make for yourself. Well-meaning people will try to shelter you from the pain of this. However, many of us who have suffered similar losses agree that these first decisions are very important. They help to make the loss real. Our brains filter out much of the pain early on as a way to protect us. Very soon after that, we find ourselves reliving the events over and over, trying to remember everything. This is another way that we acknowledge the loss. Until the loss is real, grieving cannot begin. Being involved at this early time will be a painful experience, but it will help you deal with your grief better as you progress by providing comforting memories of having performed loving, caring acts for your baby.

The truth isn't that you will be delighted to hear that a friend or other loved one has just given birth to a healthy baby.

The truth is that you may find it very difficult to be around mothers with young babies. You may be hurt, or angry, or jealous. You may wonder why you couldn't have had that joy. You may be resentful, or refuse to see friends with new babies. You may even secretly wish that the same thing would happen to someone else. You want someone to understand how it feels. You may also feel very ashamed that you could wish such things on people you love or care about, or think that you must be a dreadful person. You aren't. You're human, and even the most loving people can react this way when they are actively grieving. If the situations were reversed, your friends would be feeling and thinking the same things you are. Forgive yourself. It's OK. These feelings will eventually go away.
The truth isn't that all marriages survive this difficult time.

The truth is that sometimes you might blame one another, resent one another, or dislike being with one another. If you find this happening, get help. There are self-help groups available or grief counselors who can help. Don't ignore it or tuck it away assuming it will get better. It won't. Actively grieving people cannot help one another. It is unrealistic, like having two people who were blinded at the same time teach each other Braille. Talking it out with others may help. It might even save your marriage.

The truth isn't that eventually you will accept the loss of your baby and forget all about this awful time.

The truth is that acceptance is a word reserved for the understanding you come to when you've successfully grieved the loss of a parent, or a grandparent, or a beloved older relative. When you lose a child, your whole future has been affected, not your past. No one can really accept that. But there is resolution in the form of healing and learning how to cope. You will survive. Many of us who have gone through this type of grief are afraid we might forget about our babies once we begin to heal. This won't happen. You will always remember your precious baby because successful grieving carves a place in your heart where he or she will live forever.
A Mother's Prayer/ Affirmation After Miscarriage
In this time of loss I call upon my spirit within to guide me to my strength so that I may find peace and completion.

I will use this strength to demand of myself and others my need to grieve completely, for this will be my first step to healing.

During my time of grief I will seek guidance not only from my inner spirit but from loving persons who may offer wisdom and comfort.

I need to understand that the soul as well as the physical body needs healing and to pay attentio to this. I will learn to accept that the soul may never heal completely.

I will learn to live not in fear and once again see beauty in my world and purpose in my existence.

In spite of my new knowledge that things happen that cannot be controlled, I must call upon the places within me that tell me I do have control over much of my life and use this control to aid my healing.

Let me recognize the gift in my ability to conceive and carry life however briefly.

Let me take joy in my ability to love so deeply and desire to nurture a soul unbeknownst to me.

Let me find healing in the belief that this oul knew my love for it and that that love helped it to pass to another place.

Let me honor this short life not only with my love but in finding meaning in its existence.

Let me recognize this meaning in not only my ability to survive, but in my fullest appreciation of all the moments motherhood will bring me, along with my deeper compassion and sisterhood to other women who've experienced loss.

Let a part of this soul be reflected in the spirit of my future children, born or adopted, so that I may know it through them.

I will listen to and trust the place in my deepest heart that tells me I will once again be reunited with this soul and will fulfill the need to hold it in my arms.

I will help myself to feel comfort in the knowledge that there is a star in heaven that belongs to me.

by Stacey Dinner-Levin
 
<font color="aa00aa">Baby Mandy</font>, u meant u drink <font size="+2">21 bottles</font> of DOM already??
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Oh.... suddenly realized it shld be 2.5 bottles right??
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Big one or small one???
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Government Doc is only cheap if you are under the subsidised rate. Otherwise, can be more expensive. This had been confirmed by the recent release of news in the papers comparing on the charges for in-patients bills.

<font color="ff6000">Dovetail</font>, i also dun noe if KK will do the scan on your post D&amp;C visit. But i think mine will not be done base on my previous visit understanding. Initally the doc wanted me to go back in Apr for followup on clotting of blood after D/C. But dun wanna too... As such, lump together with the Post D&amp;C check, which is tml. Will not be going, but might change my appt... see how lah..
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<font color="ff6000">Dovetail</font>, i think we have to be abt 3-6hrs (cant rem the exact hrs) without food so as to clear the tummy before we can go for the washing. I was deprieve from water &amp; food for almost 22hrs. No drip was given till i complaint many many times. But at the end i rejected the drip.

<font color="ff6000">Dovetail</font>, how come ur hubby can be with you? Your hubby made noise and then they admitted you for operation? I made lots of noises and yet no-one cares! Hubby can only be with me during visiting hours!!

But, as a private patient, it is sad that you also suffered so much. Maybe u wanna write in to complain? By the way, how many weeks will you at that time?

<font color="0000ff">Odie</font>, you back from holidays? Glad that you enjoy ur trip!
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You must try not to think too much hor!! Take care! So will u be ttc-ing now since ur gynae gave u the <font color="119911">green light</font>?
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<font color="0077aa">Poohy</font>, how are you? Seemed like quite sometime din see you?
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tears,

oh i was on course these few days so cant access internet
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hey I tested using ovulation test kit yesterday and the test bar was lighter compared to control bar. So I am not ovulating soon I guess. Now I everday countdown to the day I usually ovulate!

how bout u ?

Odie, glad you had a nice trip
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So u start ttc now ?
 
<font color="0077aa">Poohy</font>, u noe, i was so stupid. That time i told u gals that i bought a Guardian 2 tests Pregnancy Test kit to test after my AF ended on ard 25/04. This is to confirm that there was no more HcG level left from previous D&amp;C, right? So i left with one.

Everyday, i will keep thinkin of using the test kit to test for pregnancy, even though i noe that the result will be negative, cos too soon and also we din really ttc very hard.
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The fear is still there, scared too soon.

But on Sunday, i really cannot tahan, jus used it!
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of cos, result negative lah!! i read that the earliest test kit can detect pregnancy is abt 2weeks later after conception. Sigh.. But guess i hope for a miracle!! Kekee...
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Hi Folic,
Welcome bak! Hope this is the cycle for u too. And of course, for the rest of us. I'm waiting for this weekend to BD...wish me luck!

Odie, thanks for sharing that story, i'm sure it's really worth a read although to be honest with u, i just couldn't bring myself to read the whole thing without feeling tears start to form...so i just skipped it... Anyway I'm sure things will settle down after a while for you.

Poohy, for ovulation kits, when is the best tiime to test, do you know? I read in the instructions first thing in the morning, but i read on some website that afternoon is good, and morning urine may not be accurate. confused. i bought the clearplan one (5 sticks)

Tears, i know what u mean. everytime around thre time my AF is due, i'll be so tempted to try...but i'll tahan a bit more and true enough, in a day or 2, my AF will appear! then i'll laugh to myself and feel silly.

Dovetail, your experience at KK sounds quite bad too. My d&amp;c was a very fast &amp; no-fuss procedure. it was done at my gynae's private clinic and i went in at 9am, the nurse inserted the dunno-what to soften the cervix. at about 10 or 11 plus i was given GA and the next thing i remember (after being strapped onto the bed) my hubby kissed me on my forehead to wake me up. that was about 2pm. I left the clinic at about 3 plus. I think it's important to be comfortable with the gynae/place/whole experience...after all, you'd want to have good memories of your whole pregnancy experience right? Maybe you could get some recommendations from others who've been thru it. Dr Kowa (linda's gynae)seems to have a very good reputation. Good luck.
 
Tiny,

i am also wondering when is the best time to test..especially when I have irregular cycle and after the m/c, dunno whether cycle length will be affected. But theoretically when to test depends on your cycle length. If you normally ovulate on cd15, can start testing from cd10 onwards
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I also read that its best to test in afternoon. Your body start producing LH in the morning, so by early afternoon, shd be a good time to test already ...
 
Hi Poohy, my cycles have shortened quite a bit after m/c. now about 33 days (used to be anywhere between 38-50) for the last 3 cycles. so i guess i'll start on day 15 (ovulate around CD19). what abt you? Hmm...if test in the afternoon means i'll have to bring them to work? so pai say...i guess i'll throw them into the bin for sanitary pads?
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Hi Poohy and Tiny,
I think the right timing to test depends on the brand of ovulation test kit u bought. Some are more sensitive than others and can detect the LH earlier? Most of my friends adviced me to test in the afternoon, but most importantly not to use the first waters passed in the morning.

Hi Linda, u sound just like my pal. She even took half a day off on her first day back at work cos' she couldn't take the stress! Now she is more than happy to have a couple of days off from her boy... he smacks her in the morning to wake her up.
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hi gals...
been scanning thru the posts... mayb i can share some light on kk if u all wan. cos for my prev preg (i.e. m/c) i was wif kk thru-out until my d&amp;c. and now preggy, still wif kk.

i hv to say though kk is a public hosp, it is relatively not as cheap, as compared to some private hosps.

when i had my follow-up at kk after d&amp;c, no scan was being done. gynae oni touched and pressed tummy area, dats all.

as for being preggy, yes, kk does not do scanning thru-out pregnancy. actuali, i think this depends on whh gynae u choose... cos some gynaes will let their patients do a scan at every visit, while some others think not nec to hv a scan all the time.

for me, i see my gynae at The Private Suite at kk. the gynae attends to me personally thru-out, and does the scan for me. but of cos, i hv to pay more for going to TPS.

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hope my info is useful. let me know if any of u hv any more questions, i'll be happy to ans.

folic, jia you! i hope this is the mth for u as well!
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tiny, good luck to u! baby dust to u...
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<font color="119911">Hi Folic</font>,
I've never heard of any back up gynae for Dr Mary Yang, perhaps she doesn't go holidays at all
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For my next pregnancy, I will still stick with her. Besides, I prefer Gleneagles to Mt E, I feel a bit eerie at Mt E...
Yes, wendyl &amp; myself were given a choice. We chose the best decision for our babies... Thank you HUG HUG ^o^

<font color="aa00aa">Hi Tears</font>,
Thank you for the info
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Haha, u r so funny, how could I drink <font size="+2"><font color="ff0000">21</font></font>bottles??
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I drank 2.5 bottles lah.
Do u intend to go to pte gynae for ur next pregnancy? I heard horrible story from my male colleague about his wife's case in KK. So very scared...

I'm not sure about all of you. Personally, I'm a bit pantang about the chinese zodiac sign. Which means the animal sign who is 6 years older than us is said to "chung" us. I'm rabbit, so rooster "chung" me. Hence, I can't have rooster baby. However, I still have 1 last try this year for a monkey baby. If I'm successful, I still can have a baby on monkey year as CNY will fall on 9/2/05. If I fail, I can only have baby in 2006, year of dog. Shall leave thing to God.

I wish all you <font color="ff0000">Happy Trying</font> &amp; very soon will have a happy family
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Hmm... chances are that we will wait for a while more... maybe until the 3 months is up.

During the initial period after the miscarriage... I wanted badly to conceive again but probably it is a good idea to let the body and mind rest for now and to pass through the grieving stage first. I do not want be in the mental stage of having another baby just so as a replacement... something to fill the void so that I can be happy again.

As what snuffles said... the sensitivity of the test kit depends on the brand. The one and only brand which I had used was clearblue. Base on the instructions, it can be used at any time of the day... just that the cross will appear more faint if the LH level is low... but as long as the cross appears its a positive.
 
Hi Tiny,

Good luck to you this weekend!! May the force be with you!!
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Hi BabyMandy, the reason why I know was because Dr Chan told me that she was going on Holiday and in case of emergency, to look for Dr Mary Yang
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I think the gynaes hardly take any holidays! btw, I agree with you.. somwhow I feel that Mt E is very eerie
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Anyway, I am thinking of going to Raffles Hospital for the next one. I been there for my medical checkup and like the place. It gives me good vibes!
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Hope you get your wish for a rooster baby!

Hi Soyabean, Thanks! I already jia you already
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Now just keeping fingers crossed and waiting for good news!

Hi odie, welcome back. you went Japan for your hols right? I forgot :p Hope you had a great hols!

Java, back from Langkawi yet?

folic
 
Hi folic,

I <font color="ff0000">can't</font> have rooster year baby.
I must have either <font color="0077aa">monkey</font> year bb or <font color="aa00aa">dog</font> year bb.
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Hi Folic...
Drama right? hahahha...my hubby say I siao.

Hi Baby Mandy
Y cannot have rooster year baby leh?

Hi Tears,
Maybe if you use the test kit 2 weeks later from now it will be <font color="ff0000">positive</font> leh???
 
Baby Mandy, really? Rabbit Mother cant have Rooster baby? Me rabbit too, you noe!
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Actually, i noe that Rabbit Mother if have Monkey Baby is very good!! But if i miss the boat for Monkey Baby, dun think i wanna to wait for another year leh.....

Is Mt E very eerie??
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Was thinkin if i shld go to Dr Kowa for next pregnancy. My hubby Sis and all her collegues, and also hubby's bro wife also with Dr Kowa. Apparently he is really very good.

Hubby's sis was tellin us that one of her gd friends miscarriage 3 times with one of the govt hospital, and after switch to Kowa, no problem. The baby even threaten to arrive prematurelly. Her friend dun wanna and one reason is 1 night stay in the special room for baby is abt $1k. But Dr Kowa managed to help to "retain" her baby in the womb for another 2/3 wks. Sounds like miracle to me....
 
Hi Babymandy.. sorry sorry.. hope you have a MONKEY baby
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Rooster is my hubby's sign and dog is my sign
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Dog good ah
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but must make sure you have dog baby in the morning.. those born at nite (like me) very "lao lu ming" whole life work and work!
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<font color="aa00aa">Dear all</font>,

I'm more particular because of what had happened in my family. My mum is a rabbit &amp; my sis is a rooster. 2 yrs ago, my sis went for ** calculation(forgot the name). the lady asked if my parents ever met an accident during her teenage &amp; my sis said yes. But luckily they suffered minor injury. That was because my parents worked in other state &amp; only went home on weekends. So it didn't consider as staying together. Hence, the <font color="ff0000">"chung"</font> was minor. If they were staying under one roof, the accident could be fatal.

It doesn't mean tt the baby will not be close to us. My sis &amp; my parents get a long well. As for me, if I were given a choice, I rather choose to believe it. So <font color="0077aa">Tears</font>, it really depends on you as long as u feel comfortable
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Like those ancient China, some children can't address their parents as papa or mama, they have to call them as uncle or auntie. This is because of the "chung" also.

<font color="119911">Hi Folic,</font>
I thought night time was better. Once born dinner time, makan &amp; sleep. So good life, where got "lao lu ming"??? Hahaha
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For me, if i can't have monkey year baby, I will wait till dog year. Mean time, i shall concentrate on my study.
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<font color="ff6000">Dear Joyce,</font>
<font color="0077aa">I'm so sorry for your loss. </font>

<font color="aa00aa">All of us who are here had asked so many whys w/o any answers. But I strongly believe that by leaving the door of sorrow it's actually the entrance to the happy door. But more &amp; often we are blinded by our grief &amp; sadness. Everything happens for a reason. Time will tell. Take care &amp; hope to hear good news from you soon</font>
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Sorry... I'm being blur again. What's the private clinic at KKH for? Pte patients? Who are considered non-pte patients then/ Those referred by polyclinics? okay... so now Mt E gives some of u bad vibes... another point to note down.
And thanks to Soyabean for sharing.

Hi Baby Mandy, yeah I've heard of that before but didn't quite believe it. But isn't it a really drastic thing to have to do? Wait for another year? Some of my friends got their bb names from fortune tellers - would that help? Anyway, I hope u get ur wish and have a monkey baby.
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Dear Joyce, very sorry to hear about ur loss. Take care and come chat with us more often. I hope it will help u come to terms with what has happened.
 

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