Childless Not By Choice Group

Hi judge, yes i m keen to take DHEA. Can i buy over from you? TIA..

Noi,tigi, rostrum thks for ur kind words and encouragement..

Sunflower, yes dr f is a very nice doctor. After this ivf cycle with him i can say he is the best doc i have met. Although i didnt succeed under him but i m still very appreciative towards wat he had done for me.. Taking care of my emotional during this roller coast ride as well..
Sunflower, after I m a either a poor responser or low ovarian reserve u think DHEA will improve my condition? DO u mind if u can share with me wats the protocol u went thru and numbers of eggs u have... sorry but really hope u can share with me.. TIA
 


lyn, before ivf there is a Muller somethg test to check on ovarian reserve i think... nuh got do this test...
 
babyG,
Sometimes I wonder whether my little EWCM cause tt even minor chance to get BFP...I tink tis is one of the contributing factor also..
I dare not try green tea cos my "Zi gong" is "liang'...so I avoid it at all cost. In fact I avoid all teas, not even those packet ones...
I eva tried grapefruit juice before and it really works...bt its too sour for me and I tink its no good for gastric if taken over a period of time.
Actually everyday in office, I m already drinking 4-5 mugs of red date drinks and I cannot even possibly stomach another 2 litres of water. On top of tt I still hv to space out btw my TCM, fruits and supplements. Sounds bz right? Sometimes I m also asking myself y m I so bz over eating and drinking?
I wil definitely try soya milk to increase my E2 and I m really happy to take tt since I hv not been taking eva since I start on TCM.
I eva tried preseed for 6 mths and sad to say, I hv not strike yet...
Tts y when I seen yr food and supplement regime, I really admire yr determination and perserverance. Honestly, I dun hv so much discipline. M trying hard to adhere to it, bt sometimes when I travel, these are not in my food list at all...
I m still trying hard and hope 1 day I will get the chance to share my success story here too...
happy.gif

Once again, really thanks for sharing so much wif us...
Have a smooth 9 mths ahead
happy.gif
 
Lyn, i used to think i also low ovarian reserve thats why low responder but recent years i think my hormone imbalance may be the root cause for high FSH thus low responder ley. U got ask Dr F what he thinks too? If hormone imbalance, just take the right foods and supplements like Babygalore listed, can help nurture us to be more responsive ley. My hormone imbalance was slightly improved via supplements and TCM i believe.

As for DHEA, no harm trying but do let Dr F know hor? Cuz its afterall still steroids. I think anti-oxidants help a great deal too. You may want to ask Dr F whether you can also take centrum or blackmores. Vitex also can try but its very very hard to get in sg, as hard to get as DHEA. Vitex is a herb agnus chasteberry, has hormone balancing qualities to promote egg health too.

My protocol ah, sure i am happy to share ... last cycle, i was on KKH's long protocol. Started lucrin D21 of cycle then after 14 days, start Puregon 500. After about 9-11 days stimming, ER and then 2 days later ET a set of D2 embryos. Thru 500 puregon, i managed to get 18 eggs, all ICSI but only 8 useable. I had 2 grade 5 (best grade) embryos and 1 grade 3 (average grade) then the rest all grade 4 (above average). This was a far cry from my old cycles where all grade 3 (average grade) embryos only, never better. The embryos look better this past cycle too. My 1st cycle, embryos all only 2 cells at D2, pathetic! 2nd cycle got 4 cell embryos at D2, good improvement. My past cycle and FET have the best result, embryos thaw and divide further, i managed to transfer 5 and 6 cells embryos at D2, that was very reassuring.
 
Sunflower, like u say dr f is very nice but cost very high so i was thinking i may not want to use up all my saving lor. The cost in glen e is really high. I might go back to kk although i hate their system but no choice becoz of the cost. But meanwhile i will try natural coz i m ready for another roller coaster ride, its juz too stressful..

For ur first cycle, how many did u retrieve? U r better then me. My prev cycle i only retrieved 5 follicles..
 
Sunflower, i did ask dr foong abt DHEA and he say he is not supportive towards it.. He did say that given to my age of 32 he will expect to see more eggs.. so he sort of hinted i got low ovarian reserve too..
 
Gan, i have seen dr roland chieng in sgh b4.. bad impression...

Rostrum, i took dr zou med 6 mths b4 my first try in kk i felt it didnt help me but rather my fsh suddenly shoot up very high after that
 
Lyn,
There are other gynaes at SGH, not oni Dr Roland Chieng...perhaps u can lok back the posts in the IVF thread. They did mention another lady gynae also v caring and attentive.
Actually our FSH fluctuates every mth. Sometimes its due to stress also. Exercise can bring down FSH also. And like wat BabyG post, supplements also help. I eva ask Dr Zou before whether TCM can bring down FSH, and she say yes. Ya, she will definitely say yes since she is a Chinese Doc. Do u tink it is TCM tt cause yr FSH to shoot up?
 
Rostrum, i know there r a dr yong that other sis reccomended but no good feeling leh. I m not sure whether tcm caused my fsh to shoot up but dr zou say not possible but i was rather stress during that period of time so i guess stress may tigger the sudden surge but doc say not possible. Western doc believed that high fsh indicated low ovarian reserve. I called up dr f he say yes but fsh not very accurate in testing for ovarian reserve but sometimes indicates poor egg quality but he told me that one of his indonesian patient with fsh level of 20.6 and conceived naturally the following mth.. that is very encouraging when i heard this but coz i want to coceive faster then y i went ahead with ivf but little did i know maybe my body is not readyn that y this time is a failure..
 
lyn, i think zaza was with sgh and she mentioned a lady gynea, who seems to be very nice.. dr yong or something.

You have already seen Dr F regarding this cycle? Did he advise what can be done to improve the next cycle? Although not doing wit him but can an idea so that can bounce the idea off with the next gynea.
 
gan, didnt went back to see him but we commuicated via email.. he didnt mention anything abt improve coz he is one dr who strongly feels that egg quality and quantity is based on age and indivdual..
 
Lyn, like u mentioned earlier, try naturally first. I have a gf who did 2 ivf, 1 at Glen E and 1 at TMC, both cycles not successful but she subsequently conceive naturally and had bb girl.
So maybe eat those food babygalore shared , am sure there would be improvement to the FSH.
 
Gan, maybe like hubby say must wait give up then can.. coz he also got a colleague wife went for ivf few times not successful then later naturally conceived a gal... god likes to play tricks on us.. Ur gf how old?
 
Lyn

I think it's worth having a post cycle review with dr f to discuss what can be improved upon. Your fertilization rate was ok and given all 8 cells, may not be a quality issue, but more on quantity. In addition to DHEA, I also heard of growth hormones etc to improve stimulation. But best discuss with dr before consuming anything.
 
lyn, she is my age, 38. Her first bb at 36.
Ya now miraclebaby mentioned, i think pandawife with CARE paragon, she took some growth hormone related med for 2 mths before starting her current cycle. Maybe can check with her
 
Morning!

Lyn, my first cycle very very pathetic, puregon 200 and only have 8 eggs, 3 useable but all 2 cells only. Graded average but i can see Dr Loh's face that time, he dont even think its average but he just didnt want to break my hopes and say it to my face i guess. That cycle BFN and nothing to freeze. That cycle, i also did 0 preparation, no supplements, no TCM, no ACU, nothing.

2nd cycle, puregon 400 and 16 eggs, 8 useable and embryos all had 4 cells minimum. I was delighted. I had TCM and ACU to prepare for this 2nd cycle and it paid off. But i didnt BFP under the fresh cycle. I did 1 natural FET after that but also failed, now i know why cos my hormone imbalance, natural FET wont suit me. I did another FET medicated after that and true enough, with better control of hormones via drugs, can BFP but i lost it and one of the reasons i attribute to i gave up too early and didnt take good care. I test too early on D13, HPT kit showed negative, i dropped all supplements and went shopping, eat sashimi, had flu and cough and took medicine.

My last past cycle was slightly better than the 2nd one as in i had better quality embryos. I attributed it to better and more supplements, TCM and ACU. I will go by this therapy again for my next fresh cycle. DHEA may have helped alittle, hopefully Dr Loh let me take it again. I would consider growth hormone too.

I am not surprised Dr F dont support DHEA cuz Dr Loh didnt also initially. But many patients asked him for it so i think he decided to try on a small group of patients. I was one of the initial few patients he allowed. DHEA is not scientifically proven to improve egg quality here.
 
Lyn, if you want to explore other options, at SGH can see Dr Yu. She was one of my friend's ivf gynae. Or NUH can see Prof W. Personally i would go to Prof W last if i want to stay put doing my ivf in govt hospital.
 
Lyn,
Not sure whether u wld give TCM another shot, bt I can tel u TCM takes a while to see the effect...and not everyone is suited to TCM also...this one is v difficult to say unless u try out.
I believe Stress can cause high FSH....really!
Before u decide wat to do next, y dun give yrself a break and go for a short trip wif dh? Mention nothing abt IVF, ttc and relax yrself? U deserve a break la...
Bt dun give up..I noe its not easy...bt time will heal all wounds and in no time u will pick yrself up again
happy.gif
 
Lyn
Share my personal view with u at SGH.
Saw Dr Yong at SGH twice. Personally, she’s a caring and patience dr. But, the svc at SGH is almost the same as KK(I had seen gyane at KK b4). Waited almost 2 hrs each just to see her and the nurses requested us to go round the clinic (CARE clinic is opp DR Yong’s clinic) to do scanning and BT. We spent almost 4 hrs there twice…somemore, the BT reports was not given to me lei and I had to call a few times to get my report….and the nurse there even dare to say none of their patients requested for any reports!….in NUH, no questions was ask when I requested for the report and it was sent to me within a few days later…
Think, in the end is your comfort level with the hosp and the med team…or would u consider NUH??
All the best to u!
 
I would encourage my friends to try TCM and ACU for their cycles. I dont think it will cause FSH to increase. Rather i think it will slowly nurture our body, regulate the hormones etc which will in turn help us get better responses. I have seen my cycles getting better each time. But it will take time, thats for sure. But take bit more time prepare for a better cycle is worth it. Meanwhile we can also try supplements and try to lead a less stressed lifestyle etc .. all these will be a holistic approach to help us prepare for next cycle. Thats what i am trying to do now also. But darn it! Think my supplements lost in post! boohoo!

One thing about FSH is it fluctuates alot month to month ley so maybe happen you measured a higher FSH than other months that time after that period.
 
Hi ladies thks for all ur info.

Sunflower, if i m keen on DHEA then i have to go back to kk liao. U still with kk right? I have seen prof wong nuh before, hubby not comfortable with him.. anyway i think i will be happier trying natural for now. I need a break, will lead a more healthy life and change my diet and take supplements( those u and babyg recommended), make myself happier and dun want to think abt bb making for 6mths..
 
Rostrum, ask u. If i m not wrong u mentioned before ur make up artist for ur wedding give birth to a boy whereby the doc confirmed that she got no eggs?
 
Lyn, good for you! Yes, get yourself physically and mentally and spiritually prepared then brace up for next cycle. Success is never too far so long as we keep chasing it.

DHEA you can go back KKH ask Dr Loh for it or the other discouraged way is just buy off internet and take without supervision. The latter is of course dangerous and not encouraged unless you have tried DHEA before and proven no side effects. And DHEA better dont take too long, just 3 months should suffice.

I am going to get my Vitex and DongQuai pills again. My current order was shipped end Mar till now i still have not received, sigh .. luckily the seller still refunded me as i had paypal protection.

Yup i am with KKH still cuz left 3 frosties there. I also wont go NUH yet, not that i dont like Prof W but i read that they prefer to freeze embryos that are strong enough to reach D5 in culture environment. Abit too selective for me cuz i feel some embryos though may not survive to D5 in culture environment can still freeze at D3 then next time quickly transfer to mom's womb at D3 and can still thrive well and succeed. I already dont have so many embbies for them to be too selective also, thats why.
 
Lyn, some info on dang gui, i copied from the net for ur infor,

Dang gui
Dang gui (Angelica sinensis [Latin]), also called Chinese angelica, dong quai, and tang kuei, is highly respected in Traditional Chinese Medicine, second only to ginseng. It is commonly used to treat women’s reproductive health issues, but is also recommended to help prevent and treat some forms of cardiovascular disease.

Dang gui is one of many species of the herb angelica; other well-known species include Japanese angelica (A. acutiloba), European angelica (A. archangelica), and American angelica (A. atropurpurea). Each type of angelica is traditionally used to treat different disorders; for instance, European angelica is often used to treat inflammation, and American angelica is said to be good for indigestion. Chinese and Japanese angelica are the varieties that have been used historically to treat women’s health disorders, and these two types of angelica have been more widely researched than any of the other species.

Dang gui roots contain phytoestrogens, which are chemicals found in plants that mimic the effects of estrogen in the body. Dang gui is said to help balance women’s hormone levels, both restraining and supplementing the body’s production of estrogen as needed. It is used to treat menstrual and menopausal symptoms, including migraine, cramps, mood fluctuations, and hot flashes. It is also said to help speed a woman’s recovery from childbirth and symptoms of low energy/chronic fatigue.

Dang gui helps relax the smooth muscles throughout the body, which makes it a potential treatment for a variety of illnesses. Not only does dang gui relax the smooth muscles of the uterus, but it also keeps the smooth muscles in the arteries dilated, helping to maintain regular blood flow and heartbeat. Dang gui has been used to treat angina, high blood pressure, and irregular heartbeat. Some studies have shown that the antispasmodic, dilating effects of dang gui may help treat chronic pulmonary hypertension in people with chronic obstructive pulmonary disease (COPD), especially when taken in combination with the drug nifedipine.

Dang gui contains phytochemicals that help boost white blood cell production and fight inflammation, and may improve liver and kidney function. It is traditionally used to treat inflammatory diseases such as arthritis, and is currently being studied for its ability to prevent or treat cancer, liver and kidney disease.

Only the root of the dang gui plant is used medicinally. It is usually dried and ground to make the teas, capsules, tablets, tinctures, and other combination products available at most health food stores.

Pregnant women should not take this herb because it may encourage menstruation. Dang gui is also known to cause diarrhea in some people, so those with gastrointestinal difficulties should also avoid this medication. People that are taking blood thinners should consult a doctor before trying dang gui—it may increase the effects of these drugs.
 
Morning!

Rostrum, yup, planning June for FET. Honestly, i am very scared. Though all of my embryos have always survived thawing, i am very scared this time round, they just wont survive. No particular reason why i think this way just that i have come to see that the freakish incidents always happen to me. Even if i can taste a litlle success, it doesnt stay with me. I feel jinx and doomed. Very scared.

Lyn, i have not started on dang gui at all cuz my pills never arrived. But yes, i do plan to take it certain parts of cycle only, i m aware cant take thru out. In fact, EPO also cant take thru out. I substitute 2ww with Flaxseed Oil.

Gan, thanks for the dang gui research findings! Think i need to start on it soon else not enough time to nurture my estrogen deficiency by June. Maybe i ask Dr Zou whether i can start buying from medical hall and brew soups to drink now.
 
Gan

how was your first day of work yesterday?

I am feeling quite scared today becos I am not experiencing anything special this cycle...3 more days to BT for me
 
miraclebaby

was ok, few works to be completed, managed to complete some. Almost faint to see 600 over emails but i think majority not impt just that i was in cc list. Was tired after work yesterday.

I have more frequent mild cramps now and last night i can't sleep because i was very bloated with alot of gas... Burping and farting thru the night, poor hubby. I was very uncomfortable. I hope it is nothing bad.
I have decided to go for early bt on monday, same day as u, will be my d14, think i want to know the result before i go for interview on wed. This wait is killing me!!
 
Gan

bloating and gas is a good sign...so are mild cramps. So looking promising. Take it easy at work...

I don't have mild cramps... I do have some gas but I took the pregnyl jab so don't know whether can count that...
 
miraclebaby, i am not sure coz pandawife at ivf thread just said CARE says bloating shld?not be gas but ovaries swollen then promising.

Will try not think so much..later going kkivf to get my baby aspirin.

U also try not to stress over the coming bt ya. I am sure all will be good for u. =)
 
Gan, Yes take BFW aft AF and before O...

Sunflower, dun feel tt way. If 1 or 2 times dun work out, it wun always happen to us. Take BabyG as a good example.
Her success is definitely a boost to our ttc journey! I tink most imptly is we must tink +ve...Really! Tink +ve is really v
impt....I noe its not easy..like my last cycle, I m also v -ve....bt we jus hv to try ok?
Jus take it easy. We have tried all ways and means liao....the rest we hv to leave it to fate..
U mean u r using June AF to plan for FET?

meow,
Nice to hear from u....Hmm...bird's nest is kinda "cooling" rite? Sorry, cannot help u cos I personally dun take
bird's nest....
 
congrats, Meow.
Must jia you all the way.
I dun think it's advisable to take bird nest during 2ww as it's considered cooling. Even once u bfp, it's advisable to take the bird nest when u have reached second trimester or 6 months.

Ladies, correct me if I am wrong.
 


Gals, wanna check wif u all...I hv been feeling bloated (the area below the boobs and above the tummy) on and off esp aft my failed cycle in Jan...and this has been on-going for 3 mths already...I din increase my intake of food....jus normal intake and has been cutting down on rice.
Though I hv went jogging before O....bt somehow it does not help....notice some of my tops cannot be worn again cos its kinda too tight....

Hv u all experience this before? Issit due to metabolism slowing down or anything to do wif the failed cycle?

And wld like to ask whether u gals exp dryness in the V-area aft taking TCM? I do exp it....(paiseh)
 
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