IVF/ICSI Support Group

seow,
Now I've diverted all my attention and energy to other things.I already think of having a xmas party, go for my mani and pedicure.Have nice meal with my hubby,meet up with my friends.I even start to plan when to make pineapple tarts for CNY! you are welcome to join my plans if you like.though I know it's hard for you to put yourself in a right place now. No hurry. relax ok? Your hubby is always there for you ya.remember, I was all alone by myself when the -tive result was out.it's very hard for me too.
 


Hi seow
I am sorry to hear about your failure. Please don't give up. maybe it is not the right time yet. I am sure you can succeed with your perserverance. Is this your first attempt? Meanwhile, try to take some bu to prepare your body for the next cycle. We will always support you.
 
hi sisters

thanks for all the encouraging words.

don't worry, i will be fine in a couple of days time. i just a little disappointed esp after going thru so much.

renee, ya, u r right, my hubby has been supportive so far. he said now that we have failed. we will start to plan for our yearly holiday during CNY. i can call the shots. all expenses on him....heeee
 
babylover,
I'm with SF LOh. yes they qouted the fees and it didn't go way too far from what they qouted, I thik it's about couple of hundreds more.And for my FET,I spent less than what they told me.My hubby has low sperm count.I have adenomtosis.which need op to remove them.but I did not do it,cos both Drs that i've seen said I don't need to go for op,unless I insist.And it will waste time.I did try the natural way but....
 
gals,
I think renee has to go for her blood test then can confirm +ve or -ve.
Let's not close the case so fast...

Renee,
My AF came b4 i could go for my beta test, that's why i didn't even bother going. But as long as yours is not here, just go for the test. MMy 2 yen's worth....take care
 
hi babylover,
welcome u to join this thread... this is a support group so what are all the sisters here need is SUPPORT and ENCOURAGEMENT! I feel sorry for ur failed IVF and congrats ur natural strike. Guess the IVF successful rate of 20 or 30% is a worldwide figure which everyone knows. No longer news.

The clinic/hospital u went is a nation known expensive one and mayb nearby countries ppl also knew abt this.... so I sympathise u for being 'cheated' lor!
 
Hi Ad,
I've been very positive and will sure go for my test tom. But the day my Dr.learnt about my embryoes was so poor quality, he already not much couraging words for me liao.even can see his facial language,was no good too.today my hubby told me to do another test,but I told him-"waste $$ and make me sad for the 2nd time"I could have be like Pot chip.AF due 2-3 days after test.anyway, you are right,don''t close the case yet till result is out. let me day dream for one more day.too bad I never been a lucky gal my life.THANKS Ad.by the way,i don get what's MMy 2 yen's?
 
blurblur,
you be at KKIVF tom 8a.m. right? hope can meet you there.
happy.gif
 
hi babylover,
Congrats that you're gonna be a dad soon.
But i agree with BB.
This thread, when it 1st begun, was aimed at supporting all of us here trying to conceive thru assisted means. We're definitely happy for you being able to conceive naturally, God Bless! And we definitely welcome you if you're here to give us your opinion & encouragement...however, I think you should be more skilful in wording your comments. The way i read your postings, sounds to me you're really against assisted means, whether it's because you've been "cheated", or that you feel other means can provide you better help.
Anyway, we're all here, not to bombard any REs, or any methods or condemn anyone.
MAIN PURPOSE, remember, is support, encouragement, and advice!

Cheers!
p.s. If you have done enough research b4 you went to your RE, you shld know it's impossible to go thru a IVF procedure under him for S$8k....
 
Hi Seow

Sorry to hear about your failure. Meanwhile, u should relax yrself and enjoy the X'mas and CNY. Maybe u can seek TCM to tiao your body and let your body rest before u proceed to the next fresh cycle. Thats what I did after I failed my last FET.

Hi Peacy

Try to steam the chicken juice at least once a week. It will help esp u having triplets. You must take extra care and rest. Don be too worry, cheers be a happy MTB.

Hi Babylover

Welcome to this thread. Think u are the 1st male members. U r so lucky to strike naturally after yr failed IVF. Congrats. However, not everybody is as lucky as u. I hv tried many many popular TCM and the money spent over the years r as good as paying for a fresh IVF cycle but I still failed. I m glad eventually I succeeded thru IVF n TCM.

I'm shocked that u r expecting $8k from one of de most prestigious RE in S'pore. I think most of us shd be fairly aware tat $8k package is only available from the govt hospital. Guess u might hv mis-interpreted his charges or you duno this RE well.

Last, but not least, I think the statistics quoted by u were not very rite. At least, I saw many graduates from this thread. Mayb u should refer to the archive.
 
Dear spore bb,

Thank you for your message. i hope that i did not give you and/or any others an impression that my postings are not supportive or encouraging.

I had posted my experience in response to a request from maxxx to share information and experience in ivf. I believe it is as important to be true, accurate and realistic as it is to be supportive and encouraging. In any event, i believe that i had endeavoured to be as factual as possible in sharing my experience.

As for the success rate, with respect it may be quite presumptious to assume that everybody knows that it was between 20% to 30%. i had read some postings about success rate being at 80%. would i not be correct to say that such postings,if not clarified, can create false expectations and hopes in others?

However, if everyone did know that ivf success rates are between 20% to 30% as was presumed, what harm would it be to repeat it?

As for your comment about the expensive clinic/hospital, no sympathy is requested or required. just hope that for those who are contemplating ivf, they should ask or be told the total costs instead of a "ball park" cost.

Once again, if my postings do not appear supportive and encouraging to any particular individual, i apologise as they are not intended to be so.
 
seow
really sorry to hear that. did prof explain any further to you? dun give up hope! as all the sisters who have all gone thru the same route as you, they haven't given up! so try to chin up and look forward to the future...be it natural conceive or assisted, that mommy-to-be goal is definitely achievable.
 
babylover,
if the person who intend to do ivf did research and reading, this successful rate is mentioned everywhere regardless where u download the material or which book u r referring to.

Each couple who trying naturally, their successful rate for each attempt is 30 to 35%, so common sense shall know the 80% is impossible. The 80% mentioned was the clinic has 80% of their patients succeed but not the patient stand for 80% to success.
 
Hi Babylover,
Congrats! I heard of a few cases where some couples managed to conceive naturally after giving up hope on IVF. You're so lucky! I tried that with TCM for about 9 mths but without success, so now I'm back to IVF again
sad.gif

Btw, can PM me your TCM clinic details?
As for your experience with the most prestigious RE in S'pore, I must say we'd been very lucky that we sought for 2nd & 3rd opinion by chance.

Hi Maxxx,
Like what babylover mentioned, from what I understand too, indeed there's no hard evidence that success rate will increase for patients who rest for a longer period than the recommended 2 to 3 days after ET.
My job then was pretty demanding and stressful. OT everyday including Sat and Sun. Worse still my job requires some travelling. I still remember how I totally screwed up my timing in taking my clomid when I was in New York bcos of the time difference.
My personal opinion is if my job stress was manageable I would have stayed on cos at least I would have something to focus on. I read that some doctors actually advised their patients to go back to work few days after the ET during the 2ww so that they can take their mind off and not be too obsessed with the results.
 
Dear Ad and Potato chip,

Thanks for your comments. As i had said earlier, my posting was in response to a request for information about experiences by maxxx who has not gone through an ivf before. I know there will be some people who have very good experience with ivf but realistically, there will also be others with not so good experience. i believe a balanced picture should be presented. i have always believed that a better decision can be made by a person if he or she is appraised with the widest scope of information and experience possible.

However with hindsight, perhaps it is not so suitable for me to present my views and experience in this thread.

Specifically in reply to Ad, i would say the following:-

a) if i had not been skillful in my comments, please point out which part or parts of my comments was/were not skillfully stated so that i may improve on my lack of skills;

b)i wished i had somebody who could tell me about how expensive the treatment was before the ivf. For then i would not believe the quoted fee of $8K. i only hope that those who come after me would be better informed.

c) no intention to bombard or criticise any RE but to share a need for caution as ivf can be financially taxing. solely intended for those for who are considering such treatment.

In response to Potato chip,

a) i did not know this RE well. wished that i had somebody who told me beforehand.

b) statistics about success rates are from MOH website. here is the link www.moh.gov.sg/corp/publications/details.do?cid=pup_info_paper&id=27918339
 
Hi babylover

Welcome to this thread and your tcm story is really inspiring for all of us. I am sorry that hear that you have been mis-quoted Prof Chen's clinic. I was under Prof Chen then when I did my ivf and succeeded under him. I agree that if I were to add the lap surgery fees and ivf, I would be paying closed to $18k. But I think you can't really total up the 2 items together. I have fibroid and endo and lap is needed to correct them. My ivf on a separate bill was about $13k. All along, the services and follow up treatments from the clinic was great (or maybe I should be the only lucky one if you might think so). All the staff and nurses were very friendly and helpful. And I felt that it was the close monitoring that brought success to me. After I succeeded, my hb encouraged me to stick with Prof Chen. There was some complications during my pregnancy it was Prof Chen who discovered it early b4 it might affect my bb.

Overall, I also agree that his fees are on the high side but stil wel cannot deny his expertise and experience in this field that has helped many couples conceive d.
 
babylover
sorry to hear about your IVF failure. was this a while back? IVF/ICSI costs are high due to the high cost production in hormones and there are only a few companies in the world that produces it. different centres/clinics cost will vary. having said that, i think it is secondary. no couple would want to go that route if given a choice. but for those who cannot conceive naturally, it is a hope for couples who are presented wif that one choice left for them to conceive.

i recently went thru IVF at prof's centre. i was quoted $13k to a whopping $18k max range. we brought this up wif prof and he was shocked that we were given this estimate. in any case, we didn't spend to the max range in total (incl. hospital charges) and my point is, depending body condition and response to the expensive injections, the cost will vary.

stress is commonly known to affect bodily functions, hormones in the body no less, are affected. during IVF/ICSI, wif the risks presented, it is precautionary that the couple, especially the woman, not be stressed during this period of time where the 2WW is critical for implantation to take place.

to all the sisters here
i hope that for those sisters who are going thru this for the first time or otherwise, dun be disheartened by the success rates or the -ve experience. must jia you, ok!
 
Hi babylove

Regarding "80%" success thingy at Prof Chen's clinic, I myself have never heard of it b4 when I was with the clinic for 1.5 years. Prof Chen has personally quoted me that the chances is 50% as the max for a couple going thru IVF under him.
 
Dear Singapore BB,

Thank you for your prompt response.

Firstly, it is not immediately logically obvious to me that just because it is only about 30% success rate for natural conception that it is therefore impossible to achieve 80% success rate for ivf.

I would have thought that because in ivf, there is a deliberate targetted insertion of the sperm into an egg, the chances of success rate should be logically higher than a random bombardment of sperms on eggs in a natural "setting".

Secondly, it appears that your comment that the 80% success rate applies to 80% of the patients of a particular clinic achieving live births may not be borne out by the MOH statistics as the statistics give the the success rates for each hospital/clinic. As far as i know, the MOH statistics (for year 2002) are the only official statistics on success rates for hospitals/clinics in Singapore. Tell me if i am wrong.
 
Dear tomatoes,

Thank you for your posting. I am glad you have had a good experience with Prof Chen but i am afraid that i do not share the same experience. The facts are as stated by me in my postings and the intention here is to share with all those who are interested the cautionary tale of what to look out for and to do a lot of research and comparison beforehand.
 
Hi ladybird,

i think we do need ivf cos hubby SA results r not good (had a good cry alone just now but i suppose hubby and i got to brace ourselves up and move on) I'm now at the ivf info gathering process. u were saying some ivf centre opens early and close very late. Any idea which centres? It would be great if i can go for my scans and tests outside office hrs.

To all,
Can anyone tell me if doc is a very crucial factor in the success of ivf?
 
Hi P_chip
I will do that tomorrow. Please do take care of yourself too. I think it is also not easy for you to have twin. Have you put on weight so far? I have a lot of cysts due to OHSS. Till now, I still feel bloated and no appetitte.
 
hi babylover

thank u for sharing. i am also under Prof Chen. Although i did not make it this time, may i just share my few cents thought.

The journey of ivf is long, taxing and stressful. Especially for the ladies. So, to me, the comfort zone is very important.

Prof Chen's clinic has many wonderful, helpful nurses. They are like friends to all the patients. As to Prof Chen's experiences in this area. I really have no doubt about it. I will still stick on with him. Like i say, i just feel comfortable and sense of security with him. I know that i am in good hands.

Perhaps u are not aware or know much about him before u visited him. I believe for all of us, we are all well prepared the minute we decided to step into his clinic and made him our RE.
 
Dear seow,

Thank you for your posting. i respect your opinion and comments on this matter. Perhaps there are as many opinions as there are patients.

What is important, to my mind, is to be able to stick to the facts so that each individual who reads our postings will be able to benefit from our experiences in their decision making process.
 
Potato_Chip,
Can I PM you regarding the TCM sinseh?
I've just visited the MP sinseh. Would like to ask you some questions on the one I'm seeing currently vs. the MP one.
 
Dear Tomatoes,

we were also told that our chances were 50% even before the start of the ivf treatment. the 80% success rate came from another thread in this website.

i am no statistician but if assuming all patients of a particular clinic had a 50% chance of conceiving through ivf, wouldn't that particular clinic have a 50% success rate?
 
Hi renee,

still have not decided on what to wear but one thing for sure, I will be carrying a black pvc casual bag. I need to try to find something that is able to cover my bloated tummy
biggrin.gif


Let's try to identify each other...shouldn't be hard cos not many pple at that hour
happy.gif
see ya tomorrow at 8am.

renee and seow, pls stay positve
 
reverie, glad you think that way. The 2 of you must hang on together and have faith.

Doc is one of the important factor but there is also other things to note. The success is very much dependent if the embies are implanted in the uterus. How to increase that chance, I guess nobody really know...could be food, etc.
 
Hi,

Just had my ER on Thur. Did anybody get up and move around or even go out day after ER? I am getting so restless already.

Renee, wish you +ve result on today's test. Keeping my fingers crossed for you.

Seow, I don't know how old you are...but definitely there is a chance of natural conception. My hubby has a very bad semen analysis result. We went to Thomson and the Dr immediately recommended IVF. As we only tried for a year after marriage, we decided to put it on hold and who know's we conceived within 2 mths and had our first child.

The reason for our ivf attempt now is that I am hitting the high risk group, knowing that we have male infertility problem and we have tried for at least 1.5 years for 2nd one. So we decided to just give IVF as a last try before close shop since we are both not young anymore.

Anyway, what i am trying to say is that, if you are still young, there are still chances that you will conceive naturally. I have also just heard from my friend that her relatives conceived naturally after fail IVF. So don't despair.
 
ladybird, my AF came yesterday afternoon. can i also trouble u to PM me the list of centers that are opened outside office hours. thanks
 
hi morning AH,
sorry I forgor to reply about which chinese sinseh I see. I'm with the jurong east Ying Chuan chinese sinseh.you heard about her?
 
hi morning tch,
thanks so much for your well whishes. I just came back from KK.met blurblur there.Hope miracle will knock at my door this afternoon. he he....(hope against hope)silly hor? ai yo yo,just a day after ER only ,you got restless liao ar??you still have that 2ww coming you know?ha ha....bestest luck for your ET ok. jia you jia you!!!
kao_kiss.gif
 
Hi Seow

Well-said!
happy.gif
Happy to know that you are another happy patient from Prof Chen's clinic... Really agree lor, his nurses are really very helpful and understanding, even to the extend of that I have become friends with a few of them and still keeping close in contact.

Hi babylover

To clarify, max chance of 50% success rate per ivf cycle also got to consider other factors like how sever is our fertility problem & our age mah. If every couple also has 50% chance of success rate with him (regardless of what problem), I think Prof Chen will be a GOD liao. Then the other REs in Singapore got to think of side lines also.
 
Dear tomatoes,

Thank you for your clarification.

Did Prof Chen explain to you why he thought you had a 50% chance of success?

Did you know of his clinic's success rate before you embarked on the IVF procedure?

I ask these questions with an open mind with the purpose of trying to understand the decision making process of those of us who had and/or are facing infertility problems, lest i be misunderstood again.
 
Hi babylover

He did explain to me why he thinks that I have a 50% chance. However, he also did highlight to me that I also have a 50% chance of a failed cycle. And yes, I am aware of his success rate when I first step into his clinic as I did some research about him and his clinic b4 I decided to embark on this ttc journey with him. With this posting, I would like to put a full stop about Prof Chen. I am not trying to convince you on all the good things about Prof Chen and his clinic; and you are also not at fault that you have your own opinion about him and his clinic service.

Wish you and your wife have a smooth nine months and you must have a busy time enjoying the fact that you are a soon-to-be father. Do spend more time with your wife as this is the time when a pregnant woman need the hb most. Cheerio!
 
it's so saddening.. my AF came again.
HB and i have been trying v hard during ML the last ovulation... but still nothing.

Looks like not much of a choice... 1 last cycle left to try naturally before we go IVF.
kao_sad2.gif
 
hi tomatoes
counting me in, there r 3 'happy' patients under prof. those patients who have stuck on wif prof believe in him and his expertise, and the care that the nurses give. we have all gone to him wif our eyes wide open, knowing very well of his charges and most of all, his professional care.

hi babylover
i think the math dun quite work the way you think it does. every patient has a 50% chance of success but it doesn't mean becos of that clinic has 50% success rate. that is, if you're assuming that all bodies are built alike. as tomatoes have pointed out, it also depends on other factors such as age and body condition. i too, was told by prof that i had 50% chance of success in IVF/ICSI considering that i am already in my 30s and subfertility is unexplained although i have PCOs and adenomysis. i cannot quite recall wat was being said but i think it was something to the effect of 1 in 2 chances that pregnancy will take place. when we decided to carry on wif prof, weighing against other options such as TCM and other fertility clinics, we read up that gleneagles has one of the highest success rates in IVF although i'm not certain if it's based on clinical pregnancies or live births. may i ask how and wat made u and your wife decide to go wif prof?
 
Hi, I'm new here..can i join in this thread? I am in my mid 30s and is thinking whether should i go thru icsi or so-iui? Are they very taxing and tormenting?

Also want to know more abt this Dr SF Loh from KK, is he a good, gentle and patience dr?

tks.
 
reverie,

To me, I trust all RE will do their best to assist their patients. I personaly think that If you are going thru' IVF you have to prepare yourself as a couple for the up and downs. Be it mentally, emotionlly, Financially and spiritually. Both you and your partner should be also to accepts the outcomes and findings of your attempt. I heard couples fall apart after knowing the actual findings of IVF and started blaming one another for their failure. And Divorce was mentions on some occasions.
In my mind, a couple must be ready to face it TOGETHER. Having the best doctor around and going thru IVF ( we all know those rides we took) but not having someone to support and cry on just make life worst.
 


Hi tch, getting restless oredi? More rest coming up after your ET
happy.gif
When is your ET? Tomorrow?

Ya I met renee
happy.gif
It was a really nice feeling as though we have known each other for long, not quite like new friends. Guess support like these is really important.

As for me, still need to take puregon, one more to go tomorrow and will scan again tomorrow morning. We mite be able to meet if you are going to KKH tomorrow.

Renee, must press on til the very end
happy.gif


Hey both, need to check hor, the ER & ET will be done by your own doc rite? Not just anyone on duty rite?
 
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