Advise on SO-IUI vs IVF?

Hi,

really had a lot to read today.
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First of all, for korean drama,try go to this website, normally they will tell you where to watch those serial online with english subtitles:
http://www.koreandrama.org/

for me, i prefer to buy but i never heard about that title before.

Ruru, he asked me to stop because saying the TCM medicine is causing the hormone imbalance which caused this 1 day (10mins) bleeding. Since that night till now i haven't got any bleeding at all. weird, right?!

But.. i decided to go to another TCM (my colleague goes to this TCM)at People's Park there. Let's see how. but of course hush.. don't tell this gynae lah. hahhaha.

Haze1ine, i will only take 50mg for the clomid because last time when i was on it also 50mg and i did ovulate. so this time same dosage but on Day 20 have to do hormone test to comfirm ovulation, i think.

Gillian, sometimes hormone and your stress will affect this LP time. If i'm on medication normally very accurate like 14 days of LP AF will come. but... sometimes also will drag to 18 days. or like my Feb cycle 90 days LP and only came when I induced it. so??? really we don't know what's the caused for this pro-long LP..
 


RuRu Cat
U dun sound very 'qing song' in ur thread.. hehe

Anyway, r u going to try the raw egg white thing? I really mus go n ask my gynae.. why only raw egg whites.

U know I bluff my DH, I hv to swollow raw egg whites.. n him, the raw egg yoke! He freaked out n say... let's both not take the raw eggs! haha

I wil wait for my turn to come n c if I hv the same feeling as when I'm on clomid... the feeling of wanting to stab my DH to death with his slightest irritation! I can understand wot u're taking abt.
 
Hi Vi4n,

Remember I told u I see the TCM physican at EYS at Paragon? Dr Xia Rong is a good physican and after eating her medicine and going for twice weekly accupunture at EYS, I feel better also. Maybe you like to consider her? She is back in S'pore from next mon-sat.
 
hi ladies, I'm back!

for updates, I failed my ist SO-IUI too. I thought I would be ok even if it failed, but boy I was wrong. I was Sooo super duper disappointed and sad, hai. I'm on my D3 cycle and am injecting myself for the 2nd round of SO-IUI. If 2nd round fails again, I'm moving on to IVF, but haven't decided if it's gona be KKH or Care@Paragon. KKH success rate ard 46%, Care@Paragon ard 35%. But Care@Paragon, you get more privacy and very personalised service.

ok got to go, your gals enjoy your weekends!!

ohhh ya, Toy Collector, sorry for the late reply, I was overseas. Hazeline has already answered your question abv, so I shall not pm you. Goooda luck!
 
Ruru Cat
Dr Xia Rong... is the famous one, rite? Heard her name many x.

Joyyy
Dun giv up hope... good luck this time round.. hope u're 2nd x lucky n strike big time!
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Ladies
Uhmm... I was waiting for good news from the PM. But all the PM said was like... there wil be help but wot sort of help for ppl who want kids, that's wot I'd like to know leh.

Another thing: Is is polite to ask my gynae wot is his IVF success rate? Or is there anywhere to find out from the net? Joyyy.. where did u get ur figures from?
 
hi hazeline,
for KKH, they provide the rate of success on their website. For care@paragon, I emailed them for details on IVF and soon bian ask abt their success rate. :p
 
joyyy
Ok.. thx! I thk I'll ask my gynae.. if he dun say.. I'll go ask the nurses! Nurses easier to talk to sometimes... hehe

Enj ur wkends, ladies!
 
hi joyyy,

jia you on yr 2nd so-iui!

hi ruru_cat,

i read in the internet that yesterday's msg is only a prelude to the national day rally, where PM will go into more details. but don't know if that includes the issue on fertility and when that is leh. it was a little disappointing after waiting so long and he never say anything. *sigh*
 
Hi Felix,

Ya I read thorugh the prelude too, but nothing much is revealed. Govt say things so easily, go have more children, but if the benefits/support given doesn't meet our needs, then what's the point. I wonder what pple in the olden days eat....that they can have like 11 kids hehehe...actually I think all these technology is causing all our miseries right now, from the processed food to the medicines we are taking, none of which are original from the source anymore. Preservatives, additives have been out staple...haix...

Haze1ine,

It's alright to ask your gynae's success rate. Nothing wrong in asking, coz as patients we pay them. Alternatively, you can ask the fertility clinic too. They will be able to tell you the success rate of the clinic.

Hope that helps.

Happy National Day, ladies! What a wet NDP this year...it's raining over on my side in the North.
 
Interesting read in today's Straits Times Prime News, Pg A6. Common Fertility Drug is a dud
-Clomid fails to improve odds of getting pregnant.

I just read the papers...some of you may have stumbled upon it already. Ok gonna continue reading now and watch NDP on tv.
 
mystyy
oh... I hvn't read the papers..

But clomid really doesn't work for me. I read somewhere if it doesn't work for u for 6 cycles, u'd better stop. I know it does work for some others... lucky them.

I went to town finally.. and found that book Ella has been talking abt..
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I can hear the planes fly by at my side.. hehe
 
hey gals, i juz started on my puregon injections yesterday.... Today is day 2. it's not as bad as i imagined though =p really hope my body will react positively to the injections, if not waste the pain =(
 
Hi ladies,

Yah, PM usually reveal actual goodies details on his National Day Rally which is next Sunday. We have to keep our fingers crossed!

Hi Joyy,

Sorry to hear about your 1st failed SO-IUI. Jia You on your 2nd round.

I think Mt E Fertility centre IVF success rate is 40% live birth. This live birth % is more accurate than pregnancy % rate alone becos we all know unfortunately not all pregnancy can survive to the very end.

My gynae didn't tell me her personal own IVF success rate leh. Hmm, since KKH and Care(paragon) are served by a panel of gynaes, so the success rate given is contributed by all.
 
thks all, yup will jiayou.
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Some Findings...

I read in the IVF/ICSI thread, that ET at Mount E is done via ultra-sound and you can watch it on the monitor. I think most hospitals dun have that, so their ET will be done the same way as IUI (something like that) and we can't see where the fertilized eggs landed.

Also, RuRuCat and Hazeline, I think the dilator is also called the speculum (not sure spell correctly not). I think for some, speculum is not used during IUI leh, that's y some of you did not feel any pain/discomfort. I think some gynae told their patients to come in with very full bladder B4 the IUI, and in such cases, speculum are not used.

IVF at KKH is around 6-8k, elsewhere is around 14-16k.
 
Ruru Cat
So it's nex Sun... aiyah.. tot on Fri!

joyyy
I nv actually c wot my gynae put in me.. but I tot I saw some plastic funnel like thing leh.. similar to wot was used during PAPsmear. But my gynae did want full bladder each time lor.

I shd ask him if it's done via ultra sound for IVF. I said b4, I rem my 1st SO-IUI didn't use ultra sound.. then the 2nd one... he did. Both charges r the same though. And seriously, I didn't feel any pain leh.

I'm very scared of the high cost. I really duno if I can afford it.
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But I dun want to go KKH. I'm very comfortable with my current gynae.
 
Hi ladies,

Yup, at Mount E, during ET, you are able to see what the doctor is doing via the monitor. It is done via ultrasound too. Hubby can also watch in a small room with a tv monitor. At the end of it, my gyane passed the photo print out to him after ET and told him where he had placed the embryos.

During ER, hubby can watch too. My hubby actually recorded both the procedures on his hp. hehe..so at least we are aware of what they are doing. And I am glad coz gynae actually explained at least briefly what she did to me during both procedures.
 
mystyy
I found out my gynae wil do his procedure at Mt E too. Did u do urs at the MT E Fertility Clinic?

It's good to know I thk and to c the whole procedure & process. My hubby was not inside when I did my IUI. He's only there aft the process is over.. during the 20min laying down time.
 
Dear ladies,

Both my IUIs at Mt e never use ultrascan leh! Sigh... And my HB was not around both times some more. He won't be with me during the ER and ET also. Yah, very sad but he is really tied up with his work.

So far have used over $10k (polyp removal surgery + 2 failed SO-IUIs + TCM medicine etc) and have to cough up another $10k for IVF so I don't blame him for placing work so importantly. Really hope Govt has some subsidies for woman seeking infertility treatment.
 
Hi Haze1ine,

I was under Dr Ann Tan from Women and Fetal Centre at Mount E. Yes, when I had to do IVF, there was some liaising with Mt E's Fertility Centre. Both procedures ER and ET were done on level 3 at the Operating Theatre. Hubby can view what she did for both procedures via monitor in a small room. I am not sure if all gynaes allow that, coz during my ET, there was another Caucasian lady doing ER, hubby told me that both of us were in OT same time, but different OT. Her hubby stayed in another room with no tv monitors, but mine was in that room with tv monitors. So not sure if its the same for all gynaes.

Ruru_Cat,

Don't despair. It so happens that my hubby was free during those scheduled procedures, thus he was able to be around. Ya, sometimes I get sad when hubby is unable to accompany me, but at the same time, he has to work to bring in the money, since I am on NPL. Really hope Govt has subsidies for us in this situation.
 
hi Ruru,

Today i went to my colleague's TCM and he was alright. Prescribed me with raw medicine (means i have to cook it and drank yucky taste medicine) but he said more effective this way. So no choice, i just drank my first cooked TCM med.

I just read the CARE website and Dr Xia Rong is their TCM associate. but hubby asked me to try my colleague's TCM first loh. so just listened to him lah.

I read that CARE will accomodate our schedule for the opening hours. So i think i will go there when we going for IUI.
 
Dear Vi4n,

As long as you are comfortable with the TCM doc, it will be good to follow for a period of time.

I went to Care@paragon twice but decided to stick to Mt e as the panel of associated gynaes run their own clinic so the consultation hours are very early in the morning. I think 1st consultation is at 8am. I actually wanted to consult with Dr Paul Tseng but he only consult between 8-9am on some weekdays then he will go back to his clinic at TMC. I find the opening hours too early and also becos I read some feedback from ladies who uses CARE (u can find the thread under CARE@Paragon) who finds the consulation abit rush and Dr Tseng doesn't have time to answer their queries.

I didn't go to his TMC clinic as I stays in Jurong West and the taxi fares will kill me (no direct bus to TMC).

In the end, I am referred to Dr Christine Yap at Mt E by my previous gynae (he doesn't do IVF) so I decided to consult her as I wanted a change to a female gynae also.

Maybe if you decide to go IUI, call CARE to ask about consultation hours 1st? Which doc are you keen on?
 
hi Mystyy

is Dr Ann Tan good? Does that mean that if my current gynae does not do IVF, I can ask my gynae to just write a referral letter to whichever hospital I wana go to?

I see...so diff gynae has diff consultation hr at Care@paragon. Hmmm...yea, not sure i like that too. I prefer my gyne to be more 'full time', not just come in 1-3 hr. Had a very bad experience b4 with a particular specialist clinic with a panel of gynaes. I still remember I flared up and my last words were 'forget it, I'm not coming back to you again.'. The gynae wanted to prescribe medication for me even when he could not find my medical records. It was the last straw after so my mistakes made by him n his nurses, wasted 3 months there and $. I should have stopped visiting him when he made the 1st mistake of not informing me to come down for day 20 bloodtest and I wasted 1 month and had to retake medication again.

Mount E sounds good to me. Got to queue long for appointment?
 
Hi joyyy,

I am not under Care@Paragon. Yup, I asked for my medical history from the previous hospital and after 'shopping' for a few gynaes, I settled for Dr Ann Tan. Frankly, I only started seeing her in May 08. Reason for the change is 5 failed IUIs and a previous gynae who doesn't entertain me much. Felt kinda demoralised.

Just to add on, my experience with her so far has been pleasant. She seems to be unfriendly at first, but after a few sessions with her, I am comfortable with her. What I liked abt her is she took time to explain to me, though the explanation may not be lengthy, but she did share with me little things like even blood test result. Previously my other gynae will just say, 'Ok, nothing wrong.' You know, when someone at least took time to explain to you, you are more assured. Moreover, I was looking for a female gynae. You can visit her website: http://www.ann.com.sg/

So what you could do is to ask for your medical history, pertaining to Obgyn and you will just need to pay a fee for the report.

With regards to waiting time at her clinic, I don't have to wait for long. At the most it would be 30mins. Good thing is all medication are dispensed at her clinic, unless you need other medication, you have to go to the pharmacy. Queue there is not long either.

If you need further info, just let me know.
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Hi Mystyy,
thanks for the infor.
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I'm actually doing my 2nd SO-IUI now, today's my day 6 of injection. I'm comtemplating IVF/ICSI if this 2nd SO-IUI (3 IUIs, ist IUI was via clomids) fails again.
 
Hi gals, i finally did my 1st gonal-f jab this morn at the clinic! i hope i dun get confuse with the subsequent jab . so angry with my hubby not paying attn to the nurse explaination & when she talked about the cetrotide jab , he went out already. man are really *@#%*!!! i remember i read somewhere someone advised to drink more water & eat more egg white. any one can advise how many egg white? hope this mth i dun get my panic attack esp heard some ppl exp mood swing after jab oh my god i am already very emotional & anxious i hope i dun get any worse.

Have not been writing here for a wk or 2, wow the thread are moving so fast these days
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felixcat u still reading this thread? are u really not6 gonna start SO-IUI this mth? ya talk about working hr i dun understand why must the jab and scans be done in the morn? so rush for work... sigh i hope tomolo i dun panic.

haze1ine so how's that book? i saw Ella talk about his book in at least 2 other thread. so where did u find the book & mind if you share with us how much is it?

Btw how often do ppl get oversimulate? Pls share with me, "qian bei" (done IUI b4) how many of u get oversimulate huh? i very worry cos i'm not ready for IVF... mentally & financially... what am i suppose to expect, does everyone stomach grow bigger & VERY obviously? oh dear, i hope all goes smooth and dun so obvious dun want ppl to come asking me "hey what hap to u preg overnite huh?"

enjoying my off in lieu for ND, i guess many of us not working today too. thank you Spore haha. Ya after much anticipation so disappt National day rally din mention much help for us. i even went to the yahoo to post my view when they post the news on govt incentive for making bb & ask for feedback. sigh, waste my effort..

happy holiday & happy bb making!! plenty bb dust to us!! god pls watch over us & bless us with luck!
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Hi Joyyy,

Wish you all the best! Baby dust to you! Will pray for you that you don't have to go through IVF and that your 2nd SO-IUI is a success! Take care!
 
hi createjoy,

i'm still here.
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i'm seeing a tcm doc right now. was supposed to take 9 days of an tai yao after my iui but i skipped the last one on Sat because i really don't think i strike. called him today and he prescribed more an tai yao. *faint*
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Hi CreateJoy,

Don't worry too much about OHSS (ovary hypersimulation symptoms) as chances of getting it under SO-IUI is quite low as the dosage of Gonal-F is not as high as the dosage used for IVF. However, you should look out for OHSS symptoms such as breathlessness, inability to pass urine, huge increase in stomach bloatedness (like 3 mths pregnant that type) etc.

Mild symptoms such as stomach being bloated and diahorrea I think most ladies will experience, so don't be overly worried and concentrate on your daily injections.
 
Hi ladies,
Hope everyone is feeling fine & those on ww2, strike strike!

Nv win toto.. that's why today back at work.. haha

createjoy
I'm only thru the 2nd chapter of the book. Quite a bit to read & I'm stil a bit confused with all the hormone names. All I know is.. everything seems to be related to everything!

I bought mine at Borders.. they hv 15% discount so I paid abt $15 for the book. It's paperback. I thk there's a hardcover version which wil be much more expensive. U can find it near the parenting section there...

I was jab 75IU for my 1st try & 75-100IU for my 2nd try, nv over-simulated leh. The 2nd one somemore a bit retard reaction.. hv to jab longer. 2 follicles & 1 follicle respectively for both tries. I hv PCOS too.

I thk everyone reacts diff to the jabs leh...

felixcat
Do TCM mus follow diligently lor... a bit troublesome hving to boil ur herbs n all but it'll take a while to c results so hv to tahan.
 
hi haze1ine,

mine is powder form, so just mix with water n drink, no need to boil herbs. but the taste .... *sigh*

i guess you are right. must 'dong'.
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i don't think i dare to stop the medicine now. the doc told me 'you've finished the med? ok come and get some more. see if can 'bao3 chu4 the baby'. the way he talk like really got baby already. i also become paranoid. what if really strike, but i did not take the medicine, then cannot keep the baby?! stressed....
 
felixcat
woah.. lucky u. Mine last time hv to boil.. so troublesome! I hv to rush back home aft work to boil.. drink twice a day. Somemore my sinseh said mus use those traditional herb boiler.. the clay type with the funny handle n sprout? My whole hse smell of the med when I boil them! haha

I thk since ur sinseh know u're in ur ww2, the med shd be good for u lah. I know diff stage of ur cycle, they giv diff herbs. Cannot anyhow anyhow mix n take one lor. Mus take as u're told.

Dun thk so much now... as long as AF not here... got hope n good chance, ok?
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I'm stil waiting to c my gynae to discuss abt IVF.. 23rd lik so long leh.
 
Hi Hazeline

Good you finally got the book. Don't worry about the name. I too have problem initially. As I read on the name appear again. Also I usually refer to glossary and I used to zoom in to read what I want to read.

Informative book is different from reading novel. So take your time to read.
 
hi toycollector,
yours is already after 14 days right? You can test for pregnancy le.
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I dun take chinese medicine, just youmeishu to bu abit...and multi Vitamins.
 
hi all,

my gynae actually asked me to do a hpt on 14th, D14 PIUI. but i kept thinking that might be too early? my last af was on 18th and my cycle is usually 29-30 days. thought the earliest to test is only on the 1st day of the next af?

anybody hv any idea? don't want to waste my test kit...
 
thks haze1ine,

keep us updated on yr next step. i may also hv to look into ivf if next cycle also fail. i've already tried iui for too many times already and my gynae wants me to think abt ivf.
 
Ella
Wil take time to digest it slowly...
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joyyy
I find youmeishu very sweet leh! End up my DH take.. I nv take. I dun quite like the taste.

felixcat
U shd test 14 days aft ur IUI.. like ur gynae said.. if ur AF nv comes, regardless of how long ur previoius cycle was. That is more accurate cos roughly, we ovulate 14 days b4 ur nex mense.

Dun test too early.. cos might get force +ve.

Today is which day PIUI for u? Good luck!!
 
Dear FelixCat,

Hmm, by right D10piui you can test urine test kit liao, but if you can tahan then wait until thurs then more accurate lah.

I don't know how you get the willpower to tahan so long. I went crazy during the 2ww over-analysing each new body symptoms and thinking of going gynae for blood test etc. Sigh... In the end, the 2nd round SO-IUI even worse, I schedule a blood test with my gynae on D12 around 9am and the best part around 8am I have pre-menses bleeding already. So sad right? My menses pre-empt me to tell me not to waste $!

This time if my IVF fails, I told my HB to bring me to F1 show so I have something to look forward to instead of drowning in grief. Hope I don't get to watch F1 show then.
 
hi ruru cat,

i guess because the results hv been -ve so far so no expectation already. i've already 'wasted' many test kit. sometimes i will even skip the blood test and wait even longer. haha, can save some blood also.

i hope yr ivf will be successful. i've read in other threads of many success stories. i hope you'll be one of them. can also give me some hope if i take the same path.
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lots of baby dust to you! jia you!
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felixcat
Woah.. D12... jia you! My AF always come at D12 for both times leh... so if ur AF is not in sight.. high chance!
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Ruru Cat
And I hope u dun get to catch the F1 show too.. :p
 
hi haze1ine, ya i seem to have more wind aft yday's jab. not sleeping well since yday's jab. wow biang i getting very tense sgsin. have even start BD , i cant imagine how i react after IUI, think the long 2 weeks wait will drive me nuts... i'm diff from u all, praying to get preg. i am more of praying to keep my bb. some how i get phobia keep thinking that i can't keep any bb till birth. the last time 2 mth was already torment. and now i was already losing sleep before i even preg i wonder how i pass the 9 mths.

i bought my test strip at : http://babydusts.blogspot.com/ i thinking get this kind of cheap strip if really test positive then buy a proper kit to test again. if snyone of u also feel waste using ex test kit can try this. i think it all work the same. i bought watson free 1 get 1 free kit before too, did thought it may not be accurate when i 1st tested positive. but then it was really true. i guess it all work the same but maybe if early stage maybe cheap kit line may not be as obvious.

oh ruru cat hope u dont get to see F1 too! hmm i think i should also set a target for my hb heehee.. you should set a target for hb if u tested +ve too!

I did told my TCM doc i may start IUI but haven tell her when i start, oh dear now that i started i wonder can i continue her medi... tried calling her today but cant reach her, i think i try again 2molo.
 
hi hazeline,
yea, for youmeishu, I can't tahang the 'smell-like-chinese-oilment' aftertaste, but force myself to drink. Usually will immediately sip some soft drinks or eat sweets after finishing. No choice, cos we seldom cook, usually eat outside, diet no balanced, and nutritious value lacking. Hubby will broil ABC/pork/chicken soup frequently though, that's the only nutritious thing we eat, the rest r all junk food.

Hi Createjoy,
don't worry, be happy.
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Ohh, today I went to scan my follicles, got to increase dosage cos no obvious dorminant follicles. I even more KIASU, I asked my gynae if I could have TWO IUI done, as in after HCG, next day do 1 IUI, the day after next do another. I think my gynae nearly choked on her saliva. Well, I read that overseas, TWO IUI seems quite common ma. Apparently not in Singapore. HAHAHA...I myself also think it's very funny. Well, just trying my luck, see gynae can do TWO IUIs not, no try won't know ma, hor.
 
createjoy
I bought tonnes of ovulation test strips from them previously.. haha Cos my menses is nv accurate.. and I duno when I'm ovulating. There's even one mth, I'm so determine to know when I'm ovulating, that I tested everyday aft my menses is over!

More 'wind' is a good sign..
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joyyy
I also nv cook one.. 2 pax.. cook wil be more troublesome.

Hey, I also read that in US, they do their IUI 2x! Somemore their treatment is foc, covered by insurance.

Actually, u jus pay the extra for another washed sperm & IUI procedure.. not very ex if ur gynae is willing to do it for u.

But gynaes usually ask u to BD that same nite n the morning aft to increase ur chances.
 
Hi Joyy,

Don't need to paiseh lah, we desperate ladies do anything to increase our chances of pregnancy. I also said the same thing to my gynae during the 2nd SO-IUI. He says can be arranged but after the IUI was done so painfully (due to putting in the dilator thingy), I don't dare to come back 24hrs later for 2nd round of IUI.

Dear ladies,

Yah, my ex-gynae also said you should do BD every 12hrs after the IUI to increase chance. Did u read about this product, Pre-seed, that helps to reduce vaginal dryness yet don't harm the sperms like YK Jelly and Saliva? Can use if you no mood but still have to do the BD. I didn't know until after my 2nd failed SO-IUI, so too late to use. IVF don't need lah. I should be going for my ER next tues. Will keep u ladies posted.

Btw, I went for my 1st scanning yest and my gynae lagi steady man. She puts the "probe thingy" into my vagina and just shift left and right and says "ok, can see eggs in both ovaries, not too many, not too few, good" and wanted to remove the probe and then I asked her about size of eggs and womb thickness (7mm). She says will scan the size of eggs on thurs.

Woah, this statement got me into a anxiety frenzy! I mean, if the eggs are not growing on target, then should increase puregon dosage right? Then finally I consoled myself that my gynae is so experienced that she can roughly gauged the size of the follicles without measuring them 1 by 1. Ha..ha..

Oh btw, she told me the faster the follicles grow to 18mm eg. after 10days of Puregon (or Gonal-F) injection vs 14days, the younger the eggs so the better quality the eggs are. Woah, so I told her I want to inject more Puregon to increase growth but she says cannot, scared I ganna OHSS. Sigh..
 


hi ladies, today went for my first scanning after 5 days of 75IU Puregon injections. not much progress though only 3 follicles in each ovary n biggest only 9.5mm. Gotta increase dosage to 100IU for these 2 days n go back to scan again on friday. A bit disappointed, but I guess gotta accept fate and hope for the best on Friday!

Good luck to the rest of u ladies!!
 
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