IVF/ICSI Support Group

xiaomyang said:
Hi I triggered w lucrin for my second fresh and got 50 eggs retrieved, out of which 46 are matured eggs... So doesn't seem to impact maturity in my case. But the day before ER, during the scan, I was told my largest follicles are 28mm! Doc told me it's due to pcos. Will suddenly grow.
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28mm!!! Giant ah! But I also heard from docs that lucrin is better if we want to do fet cycles and not fresh. The LH levels for trigger is better in pregnyl than Lucrin. This is what I know. That's why ladies who almost ohss doc will not use pregnyl as it will worsen the hormones
 


Dreamscometrue said:
Anyway spoke to prof abt fresh vs FET, to him both have equal success rate.. Don't know is it him being so optimistic, but no doubt he say the thawing process is not 100% successful.
I told him cos I got BFP via FET, so I thought it works better for me.. However he did mention that if do a fresh cycle but ET only via FET, then will be utilizing 2 grants... This makes me think twice whether I should do that... It's going to be my 3rd fresh cycle, the last cycle that can use govt grant and medisave... :(
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I did Fresh but with delayed ET ie. FET They told me I could claim medisave reimbursement for the fresh and FET but I only claimed for the fresh. So I guess if you want to do delayed ET ie. FET, you can choose to not use the medisave reimbursement for that and pay cash instead.
 
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muff said:
Im so envious you get to do jabs and not inserts !! :p
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Actually I find the jab quite painful. For me, my Dr said she gave max coverage so during 2ww she gave me Progesterone injection every 3 days (I had to go to the hospital) and crinone inserts twice daily for the 2 weeks. After BT, she gave me duphaston + progynova to be taken all the way till end of first trimester. But there was a couple of days when the crinone and duphaston overlap.
 
the_spinsterella said:
Actually I find the jab quite painful. For me, my Dr said she gave max coverage so during 2ww she gave me Progesterone injection every 3 days (I had to go to the hospital) and crinone inserts twice daily for the 2 weeks. After BT, she gave me duphaston + progynova to be taken all the way till end of first trimester. But there was a couple of days when the crinone and duphaston overlap.
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Just curious, who's your doc? Im with kkh and wondering if can ask for progesterone jabs and inserts too. My first round i was only given inserts.
 
the_spinsterella said:
Actually I find the jab quite painful. For me, my Dr said she gave max coverage so during 2ww she gave me Progesterone injection every 3 days (I had to go to the hospital) and crinone inserts twice daily for the 2 weeks. After BT, she gave me duphaston + progynova to be taken all the way till end of first trimester. But there was a couple of days when the crinone and duphaston overlap.
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Yours is the oil base japs? Coz only oil based need to go hospital or professional help to jap. It's very painful & will cause bruises. My hcg japs is water based & can be self jap at home. Not that painful as I remembered. I was given only duphaston after my BT for the support but I got spotting which they term it as threaten miscarriage on week 5 close to week 6, panic went to o&g straight and they up my dosage for the duphaston. That's the time the doc cmf my pregnancy (a singleton) through v-ultrasound and I heard my baby's heartbeat for the first time. I was surprised to hear the heartbeat at such an early stage.
 
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Goingcircles said:
Yours is the oil base japs? Coz only oil based need to go hospital or professional help to jap. It's very painful & will cause bruises. My hcg japs is water based & can be self jap at home. Not that painful as I remembered. I was given only duphaston after my BT for the support but I got spotting which they term it as threaten miscarriage on week 5 close to week 6, panic went to o&g straight and they up my dosage for the duphaston. That's the time the doc cmf my pregnancy (a singleton) through v-ultrasound and I heard my baby's heartbeat for the first time. I was surprised to hear the heartbeat at such an early stage.
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Ehhhhhh I'm abit confused. Hcg jabs can be treated as progesterone support ?
 
muff said:
28mm!!! Giant ah! But I also heard from docs that lucrin is better if we want to do fet cycles and not fresh. The LH levels for trigger is better in pregnyl than Lucrin. This is what I know. That's why ladies who almost ohss doc will not use pregnyl as it will worsen the hormones
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Ya I was worried that my follicles are overripe cos I think the normal size is about 20-22mm. Turned out to be ok, but you are right. I was at risk of OhSS and so doc opt for lucrin. And I was not going to do a fresh transfer anyway, so lucrin was the perfect trigger choice for me then.
 
muff said:
Ehhhhhh I'm abit confused. Hcg jabs can be treated as progesterone support ?
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Ermm... If I remember correctly I was given pregnyl japs (hcg) at a lower dosage after my ET. Dr says it's less painful than the oil based japs (which is progesterone I supposed). I remembered I need to mix the powder with a solution. Quite 麻烦 to mix it and I'm quite stress up with it at that time. Think you can google how to mix pregnyl and you can find some vids on it.
 
muff said:
Ehhhhhh I'm abit confused. Hcg jabs can be treated as progesterone support ?
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The more accurate term is "luteal support" - referring to medications given to support the luteal phase. The luteal phase for natural menstrual cycle is the phase post-ovulation, for IVF it refers to the phase post-embryo transfer. The aim is to increase the progesterone levels to create a more conducive "environment" in the womb for the embryo to implant.

Hcg injections (pregnyl) can be used as luteal support. The way it works is that it kinda tricks the body into thinking that there's a pregnancy, so induces the progesterone hormone to be produced. However not all people are suitable to use hcg, particularly those who are at risk for OHSS (high number of eggs produced, already showing signs of OHSS prior to egg retrieval). Also careful calculation in the pregnancy test date is needed to avoid getting a false positive due to the remaining hcg injection levels in the body.

Progesterone medications currently in use in Singapore are as vaginal inserts (pessery), gel (Crinone as example), oral tablets (duphaston) and oil-based injections. There is no water-based progesterone injection. Of course the injection type is the most direct way of getting the hormones into the body, but it's painful since the injection has to be done into the muscle and may need to be injected daily (or depending on the centre's protocol).
 
skyangel said:
The more accurate term is "luteal support" - referring to medications given to support the luteal phase. The luteal phase for natural menstrual cycle is the phase post-ovulation, for IVF it refers to the phase post-embryo transfer. The aim is to increase the progesterone levels to create a more conducive "environment" in the womb for the embryo to implant.

Hcg injections (pregnyl) can be used as luteal support. The way it works is that it kinda tricks the body into thinking that there's a pregnancy, so induces the progesterone hormone to be produced. However not all people are suitable to use hcg, particularly those who are at risk for OHSS (high number of eggs produced, already showing signs of OHSS prior to egg retrieval). Also careful calculation in the pregnancy test date is needed to avoid getting a false positive due to the remaining hcg injection levels in the body.

Progesterone medications currently in use in Singapore are as vaginal inserts (pessery), gel (Crinone as example), oral tablets (duphaston) and oil-based injections. There is no water-based progesterone injection. Of course the injection type is the most direct way of getting the hormones into the body, but it's painful since the injection has to be done into the muscle and may need to be injected daily (or depending on the centre's protocol).
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Wow what an detail explanation!
 
Goingcircles said:
Yours is the oil base japs? Coz only oil based need to go hospital or professional help to jap. It's very painful & will cause bruises. My hcg japs is water based & can be self jap at home. Not that painful as I remembered. I was given only duphaston after my BT for the support but I got spotting which they term it as threaten miscarriage on week 5 close to week 6, panic went to o&g straight and they up my dosage for the duphaston. That's the time the doc cmf my pregnancy (a singleton) through v-ultrasound and I heard my baby's heartbeat for the first time. I was surprised to hear the heartbeat at such an early stage.
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Yup the oil based one. I had to go to the hospital every 3 days. And it was sore even after the injections.
 
skyangel said:
The more accurate term is "luteal support" - referring to medications given to support the luteal phase. The luteal phase for natural menstrual cycle is the phase post-ovulation, for IVF it refers to the phase post-embryo transfer. The aim is to increase the progesterone levels to create a more conducive "environment" in the womb for the embryo to implant.

Hcg injections (pregnyl) can be used as luteal support. The way it works is that it kinda tricks the body into thinking that there's a pregnancy, so induces the progesterone hormone to be produced. However not all people are suitable to use hcg, particularly those who are at risk for OHSS (high number of eggs produced, already showing signs of OHSS prior to egg retrieval). Also careful calculation in the pregnancy test date is needed to avoid getting a false positive due to the remaining hcg injection levels in the body.

Progesterone medications currently in use in Singapore are as vaginal inserts (pessery), gel (Crinone as example), oral tablets (duphaston) and oil-based injections. There is no water-based progesterone injection. Of course the injection type is the most direct way of getting the hormones into the body, but it's painful since the injection has to be done into the muscle and may need to be injected daily (or depending on the centre's protocol).
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Wow!!! Thanks for the detailed explanation. For a moment you sound like a doctor ! Hehe
 
Dreamscometrue said:
I really think we should be given Govt grant for more than 3 cycles.. Maybe we should all write in to minister of health.. Especially when election is near
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LOL , i ever thought of writing to PM Lee about granting some sort of co-fund to us even if we go private because government too long the queue. And if Singapore keeps advocating they want more babies, they really should help us, not just look at those who is married but doesnt want to have kids one. I feel that we are forgotten. so sad.
 
muff said:
LOL , i ever thought of writing to PM Lee about granting some sort of co-fund to us even if we go private because government too long the queue. And if Singapore keeps advocating they want more babies, they really should help us, not just look at those who is married but doesnt want to have kids one. I feel that we are forgotten. so sad.
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I think to argue for Pte not so easy.. Try to argue for more grants for Govt hosp first? When is next election? Haha
 
muff said:
LOL , i ever thought of writing to PM Lee about granting some sort of co-fund to us even if we go private because government too long the queue. And if Singapore keeps advocating they want more babies, they really should help us, not just look at those who is married but doesnt want to have kids one. I feel that we are forgotten. so sad.
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Having said that, when u switch from Pte to Govt, do u still get to use the grant? Or they count in your cycles at Pte as well?
 
muff said:
LOL , i ever thought of writing to PM Lee about granting some sort of co-fund to us even if we go private because government too long the queue. And if Singapore keeps advocating they want more babies, they really should help us, not just look at those who is married but doesnt want to have kids one. I feel that we are forgotten. so sad.
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Yes, totally agree with you Muff.. I also wanted to write on his facebook.. but I think best to be anonymous.. haha..
They should understand that with women getting married older, more infertility issues will arise, should help us more to achieve the goal of more babies.
 
Dreamscometrue said:
Having said that, when u switch from Pte to Govt, do u still get to use the grant? Or they count in your cycles at Pte as well?
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when you are pte you can only use your medisave grant which is the $6k, $5k, $4k only. When you are at Government you get to use both your medisave + cofund together. If you go from pte to government, it depends how much are you left with in your medisave then they will combine it with your cofund lor.
 
Lurora said:
Yes, totally agree with you Muff.. I also wanted to write on his facebook.. but I think best to be anonymous.. haha..
They should understand that with women getting married older, more infertility issues will arise, should help us more to achieve the goal of more babies.
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ya i also think it is better to be anonymous ahahah! you never know.... hah!
 
When they interview or do survey n couples tell them oh they don't want babies cos of career or no money. Do U think is really true. No one would admit oh my hubby sperm no good or I have egg or womb problem so no children. Even last time fren or relative asked me I would just brush them off saying I don't really want kids or wait another two more yrs etc. I don't want to admit I have difficulties so to outsider probably they feel these batch of people only interested in career or freedom.
 
Bunny33 said:
When they interview or do survey n couples tell them oh they don't want babies cos of career or no money. Do U think is really true. No one would admit oh my hubby sperm no good or I have egg or womb problem so no children. Even last time fren or relative asked me I would just brush them off saying I don't really want kids or wait another two more yrs etc. I don't want to admit I have difficulties so to outsider probably they feel these batch of people only interested in career or freedom.
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Exactly! That's why news always report people don't want.. Who will say they can't conceive..
 
Dreamscometrue said:
Exactly! That's why news always report people don't want.. Who will say they can't conceive..
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true lor, who would say that. but the worse thing is the gov so naive meh? didnt they run statistics from hospital for people who goes for infertility treatment? Should ask PM lee to go walk one round in KKH and TFC and ask them personally why you dont want to give birth ah? omg.
 
muff said:
true lor, who would say that. but the worse thing is the gov so naive meh? didnt they run statistics from hospital for people who goes for infertility treatment? Should ask PM lee to go walk one round in KKH and TFC and ask them personally why you dont want to give birth ah? omg.
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Never hear of any MPs bringing up this topic also. I thought surely must have female MPs who suffer from this issue or knows someone who does, or even male MPs. But then again, even if there are, maybe they dont need the subsidy at all la.. so they dont understand.
 
Sorry I forgot which lady has seen dr Zhu ping at Hua Mei Tcm before. I wanna ask if the powdered meds are bitter? Are they in small sachet that u need to have a few or they mix for u already?
 
Should allow private Singaporean patients to have the grant too to lessen the load from KKH... Then queue no need so long... Sometimes actually got hope one wait until too old no hope Liao.
 
muff said:
LOL , i ever thought of writing to PM Lee about granting some sort of co-fund to us even if we go private because government too long the queue. And if Singapore keeps advocating they want more babies, they really should help us, not just look at those who is married but doesnt want to have kids one. I feel that we are forgotten. so sad.
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I also got think of this. Writing annoymous to minister n ask them to consider extending grant for private to provide support on having more babies. But no guts to write. This grant will definately help us people here. Maybi should pick up e courage to write to e female minister looking into family planning..
 
Dreamscometrue said:
Exactly! That's why news always report people don't want.. Who will say they can't conceive..
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That's the problem when people don't admit they are having problems in conceiving making govt think that people don't want to have kids.
But then, who will admit. I think the 心态 towards seeking help to aid in conceiving must be positive to give awareness of the problems we are facing. Especially ivf thingy is getting common and more people are going for ivf in the recent years. Who know in future down the road the ratio of ivf babies vs naturally concieve babies are greater?
Maybe govt is a afraid of people abusing the govt in order to conceive. I notice people seeking in iui or ivf are getting younger, some even in their early or mid twenties. But then are they really having problems in conceiving or just because they are lazy to try/wait/mk or whatever that they go straight to ivf? We don't know also coz they can use unexplained fertility issues and age thing to go for ivf. I will be 捶心肝 and 不甘心 if such people are here (those who strike the first time with singleton or twins) to compete with us who are really having problems in conceiving.
I do agree in giving more govt grants and co-funds for more cycles or can combine the number of fresh and frozen cycles and adjust the grants accordingly coz not everybody got enough embies to be freezed leh. That's my penny of thoughts lah and no intention to offend anybody.
 
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Dreamscometrue said:
Anyway spoke to prof abt fresh vs FET, to him both have equal success rate.. Don't know is it him being so optimistic, but no doubt he say the thawing process is not 100% successful.
I told him cos I got BFP via FET, so I thought it works better for me.. However he did mention that if do a fresh cycle but ET only via FET, then will be utilizing 2 grants... This makes me think twice whether I should do that... It's going to be my 3rd fresh cycle, the last cycle that can use govt grant and medisave... :(
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There are 2 different sets of grants. I had used 3 grants for fresh cycles and 1 grant on FET. I'm going for my next FET which will be the 2nd FET grant. That was what the nurse explained to me previously when I did my 1st FET. I can't remember how much but it should be something like $1000 cos FET costs lesser.
 
lovetohavekids said:
There are 2 different sets of grants. I had used 3 grants for fresh cycles and 1 grant on FET. I'm going for my next FET which will be the 2nd FET grant. That was what the nurse explained to me previously when I did my 1st FET. I can't remember how much but it should be something like $1000 cos FET costs lesser.
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Yes there's separate grant. However use of medisave is fixed at a certain amt.. So if u used a lot for fresh then FET won't have much left
 
Goingcircles said:
That's the problem when people don't admit they are having problems in conceiving making govt think that people don't want to have kids.
But then, who will admit. I think the 心态 towards seeking help to aid in conceiving must be positive to give awareness of the problems we are facing. Especially ivf thingy is getting common and more people are going for ivf in the recent years. Who know in future down the road the ratio of ivf babies vs naturally concieve babies are greater?
Maybe govt is a afraid of people abusing the govt in order to conceive. I notice people seeking in iui or ivf are getting younger, some even in their early or mid twenties. But then are they really having problems in conceiving or just because they are lazy to try/wait/mk or whatever that they go straight to ivf? We don't know also coz they can use unexplained fertility issues and age thing to go for ivf. I will be 捶心肝 and 不甘心 if such people are here (those who strike the first time with singleton or twins) to compete with us who are really having problems in conceiving.
I do agree in giving more govt grants and co-funds for more cycles or can combine the number of fresh and frozen cycles and adjust the grants accordingly coz not everybody got enough embies to be freezed leh. That's my penny of thoughts lah and no intention to offend anybody.
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Hi hi going circles, don't feel upset. . I do agree that govt should look into giving us more grants or even jus to let us use medisave. But I think no one would want to try having babies via iui or ivf if they can have normally lah. I feel a lot of younger people has problem could be due to our unhealthy lifestyle and food intake, including processed food.

Sometimes I jus think, medisave is our money and moreover we have so many insurance policy.. why don't let us use our balance funds right. Sometimes they really have to trust us that we can managed our own funds.
 
thejewelbox said:
Hi hi going circles, don't feel upset. . I do agree that govt should look into giving us more grants or even jus to let us use medisave. But I think no one would want to try having babies via iui or ivf if they can have normally lah. I feel a lot of younger people has problem could be due to our unhealthy lifestyle and food intake, including processed food.

Sometimes I jus think, medisave is our money and moreover we have so many insurance policy.. why don't let us use our balance funds right. Sometimes they really have to trust us that we can managed our own funds.
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I'm not upset lah. But I do come across such people one is my friend's friend and another happened to be one of my not so close relative. Both are in mid to late twenties. The reason they went for ivf is that they feel that is faster than trying naturally plus there's a possibly can strike with twins. Best is a boy and a girl that kinda thinking. I almost rolled eyes when I heard this lor.

I do agree on the medisave part. Best is don't set a limit on the amount using our medisave so that even if we go pte hospital will not be so siong for us.
 
Goingcircles said:
I'm not upset lah. But I do come across such people one is my friend's friend and another happened to be one of my not so close relative. Both are in mid to late twenties. The reason they went for ivf is that they feel that is faster than trying naturally plus there's a possibly can strike with twins. Best is a boy and a girl that kinda thinking. I almost rolled eyes when I heard this lor.

I do agree on the medisave part. Best is don't set a limit on the amount using our medisave so that even if we go pte hospital will not be so siong for us.
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Yes yes! Setting a limit to those with over and above enough medisave and tons of insurance to cover our lifetimes. And then we pay cash like iui then part payment for ivf etc.. end up I really not sure what is the point of having a medisave.
 
Goingcircles said:
I'm not upset lah. But I do come across such people one is my friend's friend and another happened to be one of my not so close relative. Both are in mid to late twenties. The reason they went for ivf is that they feel that is faster than trying naturally plus there's a possibly can strike with twins. Best is a boy and a girl that kinda thinking. I almost rolled eyes when I heard this lor.

I do agree on the medisave part. Best is don't set a limit on the amount using our medisave so that even if we go pte hospital will not be so siong for us.
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Wah lau..... We so Jialat liao and they come ivf to be faster ah. But huh they need to pass a lot of test to be eligible for ivf one leh. Doctors never ask clearly meh omg. They come jam the queue leh no wonder I wait at kkh for 3hrs Ahahah
 
muff said:
Wah lau..... We so Jialat liao and they come ivf to be faster ah. But huh they need to pass a lot of test to be eligible for ivf one leh. Doctors never ask clearly meh omg. They come jam the queue leh no wonder I wait at kkh for 3hrs Ahahah
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I'm not too sure in this never ask too details but to what I know both no major issues except for hubbies are much older than them. Maybe hubbies got male issues or other problems which they did not disclose. One of them got a mc before and got phobia of BD to try naturally. Maybe it's the psychological thingy that that they can't conquer or some underlaying issues that i don't knw which makes them go into ivf route. I know I shouldn't be so skeptical or make any comments on their ivf journey but then can't help feeling envious of them or thinking why they so lucky to strike for the first time while we need to try multiple rounds in order to succeed.
 
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There are guidelines from MOH which state the indications for doctors to recommend IVF for patients:

https://www.moh.gov.sg/content/dam/...althcare institutions/2011/AR_LTCs_260411.pdf

Note page 9, on idiopathic (or unexplained) infertility. Couple has to have undergone full investigations, married for 3 years, tried alternative treatments for fertility (can be ovulation meds, iui) for at least a year before the doctor can say the cause is unexplained. So doctors cannot anyhow refer patients for IVF. IVF Centres have to keep patient records for MOH to do audits as well, to ensure the IVF treatment is not abused.
 
Goingcircles said:
I'm not too sure in this never ask too details but to what I know both no major issues except for hubbies are much older than them. Maybe hubbies got male issues or other problems which they did not disclose. One of them got a mc before and got phobia of BD to try naturally. Maybe it's the psychological thingy that that they can't conquer or some underlaying issues that i don't knw which makes them go into ivf route. I know I shouldn't be so skeptical or make any comments on their ivf journey but then can't help feeling envious of them or thinking why they so lucky to strike for the first time while we need to try multiple rounds in order to succeed.
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i totally understand how you feel. First time strikers are really lucky and sometimes we cant help feeling sad for ourselves. Conflict feelings. happy that they strike, sad for ourselves and we ask why we so suay. o_O
 
muff said:
Wah lau..... We so Jialat liao and they come ivf to be faster ah. But huh they need to pass a lot of test to be eligible for ivf one leh. Doctors never ask clearly meh omg. They come jam the queue leh no wonder I wait at kkh for 3hrs Ahahah
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@muff u wait at KKH for 3 hrs for wat procedure huh? :p
 
muff said:
Scan -> see doc next room -> collect meds from pharmacy -> go back teaching room OMG!!!! that was the longest!!! But i reached at 940 la. hehehe. Scan is the fastest lor, the rest is really ping pong queue number. can die.
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Erm... Is your hubby or anyone accompany you? For my past cycles, my hubby will rush to pharmacy to collect meds for me while I'm waiting to see doc after my scans. If he's done with the collections meds, he will come down meet me but if I'm done seeing dr first I will go up look for him. The waiting time to collect meds at kk pharmacy can be horribly long.
 
Goingcircles said:
Erm... Is your hubby or anyone accompany you? For my past cycles, my hubby will rush to pharmacy to collect meds for me while I'm waiting to see doc after my scans. If he's done with the collections meds, he will come down meet me but if I'm done seeing dr first I will go up look for him. The waiting time to collect meds at kk pharmacy can be horribly long.
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Is it?! We only get the meds after we see the doc... That's the second round meds. I remember the first time was worse. U scan then take q go recep counter they explain the start cycle then give u the meds form then go pharmacy. Stab me ba.
 
muff said:
Is it?! We only get the meds after we see the doc... That's the second round meds. I remember the first time was worse. U scan then take q go recep counter they explain the start cycle then give u the meds form then go pharmacy. Stab me ba.
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Haha think that's how structured govt hospital works ba (or is it only KKH)?
I mean hubby can go collect meds after getting the prescription while you wait for your turn for your next consultation. If no more consultation after that then bo bian gotta q and wait for the meds lor.
 


Goingcircles said:
Haha think that's how structured govt hospital works ba (or is it only KKH)?
I mean hubby can go collect meds after getting the prescription while you wait for your turn for your next consultation. If no more consultation after that then bo bian gotta q and wait for the meds lor.
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Ya Lor. Next time I know. Ask him cheong to pharmacy first!! Ahah
 
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