Genetic Ultrascan vs Amniocentesis


Fruche,
Glad to know your test result turns out well. Happy for u.
My risk of trisomy 13 was estimated 1:20 (very high risk) therefore KKH strongly recommendinvasive tests. but they claimed both CVS and amnio has same risk profile in KKH, thats 1 in 300 M/C risk. But what I researched online was exactly like what u said, CVS has higher risk. Therefore I am quite hesitated to take that.
Thanks for recommendation, I think I will consult prof first.
You didn't do anything until seeing prof in week 15-16? I'm in my 12 week now, I guess I cant wait that long.

TaraG,
Thanks for the inspiring video clip. In fact my friend forwarded this to me before, but due to some reasons, I didn't view it. God is so real, I believe it's God who leads me to this thread.
Thanks.
 
Ixora, big hugs. I've done both amnio (2x infact) and genetic tests so I would like to offer my two cents worth.

Pretty sure you already know why CVS is more accurate compared to amnio. Key is to have someone good to do it for you. It's the skill of the doc performing the test that lessens the risk and also you yourself must take care to rest more.

You are in week 12. Call Prof's clinic and ask, I believe genetic scans can be done as early as week 14 (or even 13). Then you do not have to wait so long.

Oscars is very deceiving, I highly suggest do genetic scan first. If not conclusive, then amnio or CVS (if still in time to do CVS).

If you need more info or sharing of experience, can PM me.
 
Tangerinez
I called prof's clinic. The clinic assistant gave me a slot in my week 15, 3 weeks from now. She said its better to do it later as baby is more mature by then. But then, 3 weeks is really a long wait for me. Haiz.
I have thus far gathered info that amnio is better than CVS. perhaps u can enlighten me a bit why did you say CVS is more accurate?
Thanks!
 
Cvs extracts cells from placenta, the cells are definitely baby's.
Amnio extracts cells from waterbag where the cells are a mix of baby and mummy. This is what my Gynae said.

But cvs cannot test for spina bifida.

I will say amnio is safer.

Best of luck!!
 
Hi Ixora, yes I waited till week 16. Cos I was told that as of week 14 on, if termination required, it will be like a mini labour rather than the suction thing so when I found out about my results and with the amnio apt etc, I realize that there's no hurry. Cos if really in a hurry, cvs will b the way to go.

My risk was trisomy 18. And for this condition, usually scans can tell quite a lot cos many parts of the baby would have problems like heart, clenched fists etc.

I am not sure about trisomy 13 though.
 
Hi ladies, any idea how much prof ananda charges per scan? How is he as compared to ann tan?
 
Hi...can anyone share their experience after seeing prof and if u have delivered,is the result accurate? I'm planning to go for amino next week n chance upon this thread...is desperate to find out if my baby is ok yet worry abt miscarriage. I'm 17 weeks now...
 
Hi Tub, are you seeing dr ann tan as well? I just had my harmony result and little one is triple x chromosome. Came across this thread and may consider genetic scan with prof ananda as 2nd opinion. Anyone done harmony with negative result and done genetic scan that is favourable?
 
Lilacz, did u go for oscar first?

Kym belle, I didn't see ann tanin the end. I'm with sf loh and kkh. My friend had bad oscar ratio but did cvs with ann tan and result was favourable.
 
mine is the opposite...
Oscar results were ok. But detailed scan shows otherwise. Dr recommends amnio. I'm wondering if I should get amnio done, or still go for genetic ultrascan. Now in week 21.
 
WOMEN & FETAL CENTRE
290 Orchard Road #20-01 Paragon Singapore 238859
Tel : (65) 6887 1103

Thanks, how do you find it?

My missus got referred to TMC by KKH and was quoted $2.3k - $3k for harmony test, this excludes another $100 - $200 consultant fees.

My thoughts are - this is just a test which is sent to US for analysis. Does not matter where it is performed. But missus thought otherwise, as she reckons a good doctor will interpret the harmony results correctly.
 
Thanks, how do you find it?

My missus got referred to TMC by KKH and was quoted $2.3k - $3k for harmony test, this excludes another $100 - $200 consultant fees.

My thoughts are - this is just a test which is sent to US for analysis. Does not matter where it is performed. But missus thought otherwise, as she reckons a good doctor will interpret the harmony results correctly.

My Dr belongs to that clinic hence I did the test there. My results were normal so not much interpretation was needed from the doctor.
 
During an OSCAR scan just a week ago, my 2nd angel was classified as a very high risk fetus and amniocentesis was highly recommended. CVS is an alternative.

Through a kind friend, we learnt about Prof. Anandakumar who is an expert (was from NUS in the 90s). We chose to have a Genetic Ultrascan and to understand further about her condition. A Genetic Ultrascan was done yesterday afternoon and the results revealed much details but it was mostly heartbreaking, *sniff*

Our angel is diagnosed with Non Immune Hydrops + Elevated Pre-Cardiac Load Index flow (0.73) + Reversal of Ductus venosus (1.25) and is given a 0% chance of survival, a maximum of 5 more weeks to go. God bless.

The ultrascans were very detailed, zooming deep into the heart area, lung area, head area, pelvis area, etc. Was also given a CDROM containing 85 annotated ultrascan pictures & a report.

For our case, was told that Amniocentesis is now redundant based on the soft makers that were detected.

Without this Genetic Ultrascan, we would have another 3 more weeks of tears, unknowns and anxiety. This Ultrascan enabled us to understand a lot more about what our little angel is going through - I believed that it tells us more than what Amniocentesis can tell us (ie. Amniocentesis focus is more on chromosones, rather than the physical aspects). At this moment, while there are less unknowns and anxieties, tears continue.

Total cost was $380 (where $190 is for the first time patient, thus I guess the Genetic Ultrascan cost about the 2nd half, ie. $190).

For those are also tearing over the past few nights over the OSCAR results and are also planning to have Amniocentesis (which is about $1,000 or more), you may want to also consider Genetic Ultrascan from Dr. Kumar.

To know more about Dr. Kumar's Genetic Ultrascan, read about his service and photos here:
http://www.ssr.com.sg/education.htm#5

I was curious about why his clinic is called SSR and found his former NUS mentor/uncle, Emeritus Prof Shan Ratnam (July 4, 1928–August 6, 2001):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shan_Ratnam

Best wishes.

May God Bless all little ones on Earth.

Hi Greentara, i know this is a long overdue post but if you are still reading this post, what was your oscar results?
I just had oscar last Monday, waiting for blood test results out next Monday. However, my NT reading is 3.3mm which puts me at high risk and I am 38 this yr. My gyane says to wait for blood test results to be more conclusive but my research tells me to prepare for the worst.

I have also booked an appt with the SSR centre at Camden next Friday when I will be 14w. They only scan from 14w for better measurements.

Appreciate your sharing.
 
I went to prof anandakumar this afternoon for a genetic scan after my oscar test results show that my risk ratio for t18 was 1:4! My fren poij ted me to this thread and I set up a appt with him. Prof anandakumar nurses were v warm and friendly and prof anandakumar was reassuring. Before scanning me,he looked at my oscar results and told me dun worry before proceding. He was v detsiled and through with his scanning. Thanks to god, there were no markers detected for t18 and he advised agst amniocentesis and asked us to consider harmony test instead.he said that the risk of miscarriage is even higher than getting resukts that my child is t18.
 
Fruche, maybe sharing my experience with you. my test results with my age and all, ratio is 1:206. which was consider risk.... i was told to do amnio test. this was my 2nd baby and im kinda of worried, as heard alot on amnio test. Thus, i went to Dr AnandaKumar, the genetic scan he did for me @ week 13... he commented my baby looks perfectly fine. Which really eased me.

I decided to skip amnio test, till my next detail scanning with him on oct 17. Im actually quite worried. If detected something then, maybe i will decide amnio test.

Dr Ananda shared this with me, "since now you know ur baby looks fine at this stage, will you want to risk a miscarriage? " he add on, if i still think amnio test is required, i can still do it after my detail scan.

My first baby ratio was also bad, i went to him. My boy is now 7yrs old. now this 2nd bb, i hope everything goes well too.

My collegues and friends are telling me, STAY POSITIVE!
happy.gif

Hi jaydenmum. I dont know if u r still active in this thread. I have a very similar case as you last time and have gone for genetics scan with prof kumar. But i still have doubts. In a dilemma whether or not to go for harmony/amnio test since i'm alrdy 24wks. Can i know if you just did gen scan despite the 1:204 oscar result and if everything turned out well and u had a healthy and perfecty lovely normal baby? I hope very much u read my msg. Am so torn rite now. Thanks.
 
Cloudz2015, my opinion is... go to Prof Ananda first, then hear what he says, then decide if you still require Harmony test :)
jia you!
 
Hi @Cloudz2015

My oscar ratio was 1:50 with NT thickness 3.5 thereabout. It was very worrying then and we went to prof ananda for scan only to be made worse by his findings. He made it sound so bad that amnio was a must. However, I've had 3 miscarriages before and couldn't risk another at all costs. We went for harmony test instead and result turned out fine. We carried on with the pregnancy with healing prayers daily, and at the 20 week detailed scan, result was normal as well.

My baby is now 4.5 months old, healthy and chubby.

May I ask what's holding you back from doing harmony test since it doesn't risk anyone's health?

Wishing you a healthy pregnancy, have faith.
 
Hi @Cloudz2015

My oscar ratio was 1:50 with NT thickness 3.5 thereabout. It was very worrying then and we went to prof ananda for scan only to be made worse by his findings. He made it sound so bad that amnio was a must. However, I've had 3 miscarriages before and couldn't risk another at all costs. We went for harmony test instead and result turned out fine. We carried on with the pregnancy with healing prayers daily, and at the 20 week detailed scan, result was normal as well.

My baby is now 4.5 months old, healthy and chubby.

May I ask what's holding you back from doing harmony test since it doesn't risk anyone's health?

Wishing you a healthy pregnancy, have faith.

Hi,
May I know how much is Prof Ananda charging for the genetic scan? I am considering whether to visit him 1st before going for my amnio.
My oscar ratio was 1:9 and I am 39. This is my 3rd child.
 
Hi

I think it's about $400+. You can call up to ask. How about doing harmony test? My Gunnar told me there's a newer test that's even better than harmony and its non invasive. You may want to ask your Gynae?

All the best for this pregnancy!
 
I did panaroma at abt $1.5k.

My OSCAR score was 1:103, everything is fine except for HCG rating which is 3.2 MOM. NT is 2mm. It was an anxious 2w wait but I'm glad that results came back fine. Just sharing my statistics above for mommies' reference. All the best.
 
My oscar ratio is 1:86 but I not sure what is my NT measurement. gynae not suggest me to do harmony test as me is not the blood issues and harmony test is base on our blood.
may I know should I inform my gynae or get my oscar test report first if I wan to do genetic scan with Dr ananda?
thanks in advance...
 
Cks_tpl, the blood test for OSCAR is different from blood test of Parnaroma/ harmony. The latter is analysing the baby's DNA while the former is analysis the HCG level and PAPP-A levels. The HCG and PAPP-A levels are only proxy for determining your chance of having a high risk pregnancy. Eg. For mine with exceptionally high HCG of 3.2, there are studies to show that expantant mothers with a Down's baby has higher HCG in the blood. The panaroma test is extracting baby's DNA from the tube of blood drawn to analyse the chromosome to test for few chromosome deficiencies (including Down's).

I would think that genetic blood test is more accurate than genetic scanning because the latter is using high tech machine to see the physical features (looking out for physical markers). However, I think that in some cases, the physical markers are not so obvious. I.e. some people with Down's can look rather normal especially if the condition is not so severe. Hence, I'm more inclined to do genetic blood test to determine if my high risk OSCAR result is true or false.

To get higher accuracy than harmony/panaroma, one has to go for the invasive test (I.e amino/CVS).

Just my two cents worth. I did a lot of reading during my 2w week for my panaroma results, so I'm sharing what I read here. You can also do some googling to determine which test is best for you. Best wishes to all mommies :)
 
For those who are scouring the internet for more information because you have gotten a bad Oscar result and are considering a genetical scan, I hope that my experience can help you.
My Oscar Scan
Fetal Scan
Age at Scan: 33 years old
Done at 12 weeks + 2 days
Done by Thomson Diagnostic Ultrasound Centre
Fetal heart rate: 173 bpm (High)
Crown-rump length: 60.0 mm (Mean)
Nuchal translucency: 4.4 mm
Biparietal diameter: 20.9 mm (Mean)
Head Circumference: 74.9 mm (Mean)
Abdominal Circumference: 61.3 mm (Mean)
Nasal bone: 1.9 mm
Blood Sample
Free Beta HCG 3.4357 MoM (High)
PAPP-A 1.5684 MoM
T21: 1:10
T18: 1.153
T13: 1.102
My Gynae’s prognosis
Amnio was the only option for me.
He would not even consider other non-invasive tests such as Harmony or Paranoma as my result was so terrible.
Even if I were to take those test, he would still want to perform an amnio on me.
I was reluctant to under amnio because of the risk of miscarriage.
My pregnancy is a high-risk one due to a medical condition. I rely on medication to keep the pregnancy going, without which it would have ended in a miscarriage like all my previous pregnancies. In order to undergo amnio, I was told to come off medication for at least a week before the procedure which I refused.
Genetical Scan
Through this forum, I came across the genetical scan by Dr Anandakumar.
The scan was conducted at 13 weeks 5 days.
I am unable to describe my experience with Dr Anandakumar well enough in words. You will have to go through it yourself to understand. To put it very simply, he was extremely thorough in his scan. He did not merely scan your fetus’ face and point out that that’s the face. He measured the nasal bone, chin, lips and took the angel of the nose and lips. He looked deeply into the heart, all the way down to the blood flow to ensure no blockages or abnormalities. He did not merely measure the number of heartbeats per minute, he went deeper to find irregularities or murmurs. And when it comes measuring the much feared NT, he used two different methods of measurement to ensure accuracy.
And because he did such a good job right in front of us, we were totally convinced when he told us that there was nothing wrong with my child. T18 and T13 which I scored so badly for were ruled out (Thank God!) and if there was anything wrong with my child that the scan could not pick up, it would be picked up by the harmony test. He didn’t think I needed amnio as the risk of losing the child through amnio is much larger than having a child with T21.
Measurements taken by Dr Anandakumar
Nasal Bone: 3.7mm
Nuchal Translucency: 3.5mm
T21: 1: 625 (If Harmony test comes back favorable, odds are 1:10 000)
T18 and T13: ruled out
My High Free Beta HCG
Leaving no stones unturned, he turned his attention to my abnormally high HCG count.
He said that a high HCG count with no visible abnormalities on the fetus, pointed towards a bad placenta, which is something that I need to be very careful about as my pregnancy progresses. In my case, amnio is not recommended because it would aggravate the placenta which was already displaying signs that it may be unhealthy through the high HCG count. Instead of the statistical miscarriage rate of 1%, I face a 3% chance of miscarriage should I proceed with amnio given my condition. CVS was out of question in my case.
Conclusion
I have proceeded with harmony at his clinic and I would definitely not be going for amnio unless my harmony results come back bad. I feel strangely assured that a bad Harmony test result was unlikely.
 
Hi

Just to share my wife is 32 years old. Second pregnancy.
T21 = 1:19
Ultrasound showed fetus had nasal bone.

Based on the comments here we have made an appointment with Dr.Anandakumar to do a genetic scan. Will update the results and hope it helps others.
 
Hi Captainrubber,
Thank you for sharing.
I feel for you and your wife and I hope that you will find hope in my post above.
Dr Anandakumar can definately give you a clear picture of what is happening inside.

My harmony test result came back last week and it shows that my baby is indeed normal.
I'm pretty sure that you and your wife will have the same outcome too.

Keep the faith.
 
Hi Ouliou thanks for replying and your words of encouragement really made my day. Awesome that your test results came out well. Will keep the faith
 
Hi Captain rubber, i was in a similar situation. Mine was 1 :12....i was 33 yrs old. slightly worse results.

Its gd to do non invasive testing like panorama or harmony. No risk to infant at all. Then if the results not gd, then proceed w amnio.
I also almost wanted to go to doc ananda too as i read many gd reviews online... but my gynae told me in his words "he's rubbish" - omg! Wat strong opinions... i didnt go to him in the end.
Anyway, i feel its mr worth it to spend $$ on panorama/harmony first... then if all good, go for the detailed anomaly scan (in my high risk case, my gynae recommended me to a senior consultant gynae to do my scan)...

At the end of my detailed scan, everything seemed all gd. and i asked the consultant gynae who said... well its worth a risk not to do amnio afterall.

Just felt i should share my own experience...
Most importantly may your baby be healthy!!
 
Thanks timmerin for your advice and sharing . I appreciate everyone who has taken the time to reply and provide info.

Think my wife's gynae signed her up to do amino as that one 100% . Didn't want her to do harmony which we thought of doing .

The detailed scan by consultant gynae seems like a good idea . Hmm May I know where the senior consultant gynae that does the detailed scan is located ?
 
The one who did my detailed scan is from Tmc - dr TC Chang. He is the head of fetal assessment unit in tmc. My sister's gynae took amnio n was unsuccessful in drawing out the fluid n she was referred to doc chang too.. so he's prob the specialist gynae in tmc regarding such high risk cases.

for amnio there is a risk of miscarriage like maybe 1 in 200... it is considered invasive. My gynae didnt recommend amnio for me as first plan of action.

Harmony test is just take a few vials of blood only n they do dna testing. It is non invasive. No risk to foetus at all. The test costs ard $1300 and studies hv shown that the results are pretty accurate. The results out in 1 week to 10 days! After dat if results not gd then go for amnio. If results gd after harmony then go for detail scan. Harmony doesnt detect organ issues like heart defects if not mistaken so detailed scanning is a must.
If u n ur wife choose to do amnio then thats pretty definitive... like u said 100pc detect everything...no need harmony or panorama at all...
 
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Hi Ouliou,

How long did your Harmony test take to come back? I had a bad Oscar result (like you, high NT and high hCG), and am waiting on harmony test results. Today is day 8 of waiting...... it's pure torture.
 
Visited Anandakumar on 7 April. He did a detailed scan and informed us our baby is normal and looks like a girl. Advised us to take the harmony test on the day itself which we did at the lab upstairs as amnio would be risky. Results came in today 15 April. We have a normal baby girl with low risk of down syndrome less than 1 in 10,000 for all 3 markers. Praise God. However Anandakumar said my wife's hormone levels are sky high and she may have a condition which causes her blood to be thicker than normal she has submitted blood test to see if she has the condition and also been placed on aspirin to thin her blood. We will be doing detailed scans in the 20th and 21th week.
 
Hi all, this thread seems inactive but I'm giving it a try to see if anyone will see my msg.

I just returned from KKH with a terrible OSCAR result for my twins
Trisomy 21 risk - 1:61 for twin A and 1:5 for twin B
Trisomy 18 risk - 1:4037 for twin A and 1:167 for twin B
NT at 2.8mm for twin A and 3.8mm for twin B
I'm 37 years old.

It's devastating. The doctor has suggested for me to do Amnio in 3 week's time. I came across Dr. Anandakumar from forums and would like to find out more about his Genetic Ultrascan to seek second opinion.

I visited Dr. Anandakumar's website http://www.ssr.com.sg to find out more about the Genetic Ultrascan and the images look like a normal ultrasound scan. Can anyone share with me if Dr. Anandakumar uses a different ultrasound machine? How is he able to conduct a more thorough and detailed scan than the sonographers that did the OSCAR scanning?

Any sharing is much appreciated. Thank you.
 
Hi all, this thread seems inactive but I'm giving it a try to see if anyone will see my msg.

I just returned from KKH with a terrible OSCAR result for my twins
Trisomy 21 risk - 1:61 for twin A and 1:5 for twin B
Trisomy 18 risk - 1:4037 for twin A and 1:167 for twin B
NT at 2.8mm for twin A and 3.8mm for twin B
I'm 37 years old.

It's devastating. The doctor has suggested for me to do Amnio in 3 week's time. I came across Dr. Anandakumar from forums and would like to find out more about his Genetic Ultrascan to seek second opinion.

I visited Dr. Anandakumar's website http://www.ssr.com.sg to find out more about the Genetic Ultrascan and the images look like a normal ultrasound scan. Can anyone share with me if Dr. Anandakumar uses a different ultrasound machine? How is he able to conduct a more thorough and detailed scan than the sonographers that did the OSCAR scanning?

Any sharing is much appreciated. Thank you.

Dear milky candy,
I wish to give you some hope. I posted a detailed review on Dr Anandakumar's scan on this thread last year. My son's Oscar result for T21 was 1:10. My son's NT was above 4. I refused to do amnio despite my Gynae's repeated recommendation because of my risk of miscarriage. I have since given birth and my son is perfectly normal. We did kyrotyping with his cord blood, so we are very sure.

Coming back to your question, dr anandakumar does not use any special device. He is just extremely thorough. A lot more thorough than the sonagrapher who had done that Oscar scan for you. Because a child with downs tend to show more than one abnormal marker, such as shorter nasal bone, shorter femur length etc, measuring NT alone does not accurately point to downs. Dr anandakumar will look at all the markers to give a clearer picture about what is going on inside. Many a times, amnio can be avoided due to lack of additional markers other than a thicker NT.

I hope my experience gives you strength and some hope. Regardless of outcome, I wish you will post a follow up so that others with similar experience, looking for hope, can seek consolation from us. Only people who had gone through this will understand the anguish.

All the best
 
Hi Ouliou, thank you for responding to me. I have made appt to see Dr Anandakumar next week. Fingers crossed he will give me hope.

I have called to make an appointment to see Dr Anandakumar next week for a week 14 Genetic Ultrascan. The price is $600-680 times 2 (for twins). The lady on the phone told me that the Dr will ask me to come back for a week 21 scan again. She says the week 21 scan is to scan for more details like hole in heart etc and it's the same price. Did anyone go for 2 Genetic Ultrascans?
 
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Hi all, I just want to share updates.

I went to see Dr Anandakumar for the Genetic Ultrascan. Based on my personal experience, I do not recommend this scan especially for IVF mummies for the following reasons:

1) He is very much against IVF and will say a lot of negative comments about this procedure. During the scan, he went on rumbling about why did we go for IVF... we should at least have tried 5-6 IUI before resorting to IVF, IVF produces abnormal babies, the process damages the embryos etc. I really did not need such words at that point of time and wanted to end the session as soon as possible.
2) It is very pricey for the work done. The machine used is still an ultrasound and the main difference is that he takes measurement of all anatomies and from there, he will determine the likelihood of abnormalities. It is still not 100%. We paid $680 x 2 for twins. The risk factor was reduced from the original Oscar test results, but it is still not a diagnostic test. So if you are looking for 99% peace of mind, this scan does not give you that.
3) He recommended for us to go for Harmony and also wk 20 Detailed Scan at his clinic and suggested against Amnio due to risk of miscarriage. However, if Harmony test results come back negative, we'll still have to go for Amnio since Harmony does not detect which twin.
4) He did not go through the scan report with us to explain what is what. Anyway, I was half-hearted by the end of the scan and I just wanted to leave the clinic. In the scan report, it was indicated that I should still consult with my primary doctor on the next steps (throwing the ball back to Dr THH's court).

At the end of the day, I do not feel that it was money well spent.

After seeing Dr Anandakumar, I proceeded with Amnio at KKH because we wanted to know for sure. Prof George Yeo Seow Heong did the Amnio for me. Dr THH told me before that there are only two doctors in KKH that does this procedure, so I trust that they must be good at it. Prof Yeo was very calm, and have very steady hands. The procedure took only less than 10 minutes. He scanned for the babies and then poked the needle in after which the nurse drew the liquid out. He was able to retrieve liquid from the two separate sacs without having to poke me twice. He simply moved the needle to the adjacent sac to draw fluid from the second sac. After the procedure, I went home and rested on bed for the rest of the day (while I was resting I felt my babies move for the first time!). The next day was CNY eve. For the following 2 days, I resumed normal activities, but I took it easy - not much moving around. I was able to go visiting and gatherings but again - I watched what I ate and minimized movements. There was no bleeding or any symptoms to worry after the procedure for the following 2 weeks. Honestly, having gone through the Amnio procedure, it's not as scary as it is perceived. A lot of people who have not gone through themselves it share fears of miscarriage, whilst those who have gone through will tell me that it's not that scary... My boss who did Amnio (not by choice, but back when she was expecting there was no Oscar or Harmony etc), encouraged me to do it. It doesn't take away the risk, but I believe an experienced doctor is very important as well as proper care post procedure.

I just received a call from KKH this morning to confirm that both twins are fine. Thank heavens.

When Dr THH counseled me, he told me two things:
1) You are looking at your own risk factor, not an overall risk factor. So there is no point comparing with other people's test results.
2) All you can do is remain positive. Feeling pessimistic does not help.

He is very pragmatic in his approach and it works for me to put things into perspective and also allow me to face reality so that I can live life in a positive light while waiting for the test results. I talked to my babies regularly and tell them that they will fine (and it made me feel better).

I hope this will help those who are in the same dilemma as I was. It was an excruciating few weeks since I received the bad Oscar test results. I'm glad to finally feel relieved now, and I can start shopping for baby stuff.

All the best to mummies with upcoming tests! Be strong.
 
Hi all, I just want to share updates.

I went to see Dr Anandakumar for the Genetic Ultrascan. Based on my personal experience, I do not recommend this scan especially for IVF mummies for the following reasons:

1) He is very much against IVF and will say a lot of negative comments about this procedure. During the scan, he went on rumbling about why did we go for IVF... we should at least have tried 5-6 IUI before resorting to IVF, IVF produces abnormal babies, the process damages the embryos etc. I really did not need such words at that point of time and wanted to end the session as soon as possible.
2) It is very pricey for the work done. The machine used is still an ultrasound and the main difference is that he takes measurement of all anatomies and from there, he will determine the likelihood of abnormalities. It is still not 100%. We paid $680 x 2 for twins. The risk factor was reduced from the original Oscar test results, but it is still not a diagnostic test. So if you are looking for 99% peace of mind, this scan does not give you that.
3) He recommended for us to go for Harmony and also wk 20 Detailed Scan at his clinic and suggested against Amnio due to risk of miscarriage. However, if Harmony test results come back negative, we'll still have to go for Amnio since Harmony does not detect which twin.
4) He did not go through the scan report with us to explain what is what. Anyway, I was half-hearted by the end of the scan and I just wanted to leave the clinic. In the scan report, it was indicated that I should still consult with my primary doctor on the next steps (throwing the ball back to Dr THH's court).

At the end of the day, I do not feel that it was money well spent.

After seeing Dr Anandakumar, I proceeded with Amnio at KKH because we wanted to know for sure. Prof George Yeo Seow Heong did the Amnio for me. Dr THH told me before that there are only two doctors in KKH that does this procedure, so I trust that they must be good at it. Prof Yeo was very calm, and have very steady hands. The procedure took only less than 10 minutes. He scanned for the babies and then poked the needle in after which the nurse drew the liquid out. He was able to retrieve liquid from the two separate sacs without having to poke me twice. He simply moved the needle to the adjacent sac to draw fluid from the second sac. After the procedure, I went home and rested on bed for the rest of the day (while I was resting I felt my babies move for the first time!). The next day was CNY eve. For the following 2 days, I resumed normal activities, but I took it easy - not much moving around. I was able to go visiting and gatherings but again - I watched what I ate and minimized movements. There was no bleeding or any symptoms to worry after the procedure for the following 2 weeks. Honestly, having gone through the Amnio procedure, it's not as scary as it is perceived. A lot of people who have not gone through themselves it share fears of miscarriage, whilst those who have gone through will tell me that it's not that scary... My boss who did Amnio (not by choice, but back when she was expecting there was no Oscar or Harmony etc), encouraged me to do it. It doesn't take away the risk, but I believe an experienced doctor is very important as well as proper care post procedure.

I just received a call from KKH this morning to confirm that both twins are fine. Thank heavens.

When Dr THH counseled me, he told me two things:
1) You are looking at your own risk factor, not an overall risk factor. So there is no point comparing with other people's test results.
2) All you can do is remain positive. Feeling pessimistic does not help.

He is very pragmatic in his approach and it works for me to put things into perspective and also allow me to face reality so that I can live life in a positive light while waiting for the test results. I talked to my babies regularly and tell them that they will fine (and it made me feel better).

I hope this will help those who are in the same dilemma as I was. It was an excruciating few weeks since I received the bad Oscar test results. I'm glad to finally feel relieved now, and I can start shopping for baby stuff.

All the best to mummies with upcoming tests! Be strong.
I'll just like to say that I'm very glad to know both your twins are fine and the worries and pain are now behind you :)
 
Hi all, I just want to share updates.

I went to see Dr Anandakumar for the Genetic Ultrascan. Based on my personal experience, I do not recommend this scan especially for IVF mummies for the following reasons:

1) He is very much against IVF and will say a lot of negative comments about this procedure. During the scan, he went on rumbling about why did we go for IVF... we should at least have tried 5-6 IUI before resorting to IVF, IVF produces abnormal babies, the process damages the embryos etc. I really did not need such words at that point of time and wanted to end the session as soon as possible.
2) It is very pricey for the work done. The machine used is still an ultrasound and the main difference is that he takes measurement of all anatomies and from there, he will determine the likelihood of abnormalities. It is still not 100%. We paid $680 x 2 for twins. The risk factor was reduced from the original Oscar test results, but it is still not a diagnostic test. So if you are looking for 99% peace of mind, this scan does not give you that.
3) He recommended for us to go for Harmony and also wk 20 Detailed Scan at his clinic and suggested against Amnio due to risk of miscarriage. However, if Harmony test results come back negative, we'll still have to go for Amnio since Harmony does not detect which twin.
4) He did not go through the scan report with us to explain what is what. Anyway, I was half-hearted by the end of the scan and I just wanted to leave the clinic. In the scan report, it was indicated that I should still consult with my primary doctor on the next steps (throwing the ball back to Dr THH's court).

At the end of the day, I do not feel that it was money well spent.

After seeing Dr Anandakumar, I proceeded with Amnio at KKH because we wanted to know for sure. Prof George Yeo Seow Heong did the Amnio for me. Dr THH told me before that there are only two doctors in KKH that does this procedure, so I trust that they must be good at it. Prof Yeo was very calm, and have very steady hands. The procedure took only less than 10 minutes. He scanned for the babies and then poked the needle in after which the nurse drew the liquid out. He was able to retrieve liquid from the two separate sacs without having to poke me twice. He simply moved the needle to the adjacent sac to draw fluid from the second sac. After the procedure, I went home and rested on bed for the rest of the day (while I was resting I felt my babies move for the first time!). The next day was CNY eve. For the following 2 days, I resumed normal activities, but I took it easy - not much moving around. I was able to go visiting and gatherings but again - I watched what I ate and minimized movements. There was no bleeding or any symptoms to worry after the procedure for the following 2 weeks. Honestly, having gone through the Amnio procedure, it's not as scary as it is perceived. A lot of people who have not gone through themselves it share fears of miscarriage, whilst those who have gone through will tell me that it's not that scary... My boss who did Amnio (not by choice, but back when she was expecting there was no Oscar or Harmony etc), encouraged me to do it. It doesn't take away the risk, but I believe an experienced doctor is very important as well as proper care post procedure.

I just received a call from KKH this morning to confirm that both twins are fine. Thank heavens.

When Dr THH counseled me, he told me two things:
1) You are looking at your own risk factor, not an overall risk factor. So there is no point comparing with other people's test results.
2) All you can do is remain positive. Feeling pessimistic does not help.

He is very pragmatic in his approach and it works for me to put things into perspective and also allow me to face reality so that I can live life in a positive light while waiting for the test results. I talked to my babies regularly and tell them that they will fine (and it made me feel better).

I hope this will help those who are in the same dilemma as I was. It was an excruciating few weeks since I received the bad Oscar test results. I'm glad to finally feel relieved now, and I can start shopping for baby stuff.

All the best to mummies with upcoming tests! Be strong.

Hi milk candy, really thanks for your detailed post and am so glad that I read on it. I also conceived twins via ivf and have intermediate risk for t21. Sgh recom me to do the amnio test on week 16 but I not willing to do fear of miscarriage. Actually wanted to do the genetic scan by Dr ananka until you mentioned that he is against ivf, this made me think twice. Spend money ( double for twins) on the genetic scan and still have to hear his complaint made me think twice. Now I am still thinking of going for the amnio test , really scare of the worst outcome . Oh no this is really bothering me ....
 
Hi milk candy, really thanks for your detailed post and am so glad that I read on it. I also conceived twins via ivf and have intermediate risk for t21. Sgh recom me to do the amnio test on week 16 but I not willing to do fear of miscarriage. Actually wanted to do the genetic scan by Dr ananka until you mentioned that he is against ivf, this made me think twice. Spend money ( double for twins) on the genetic scan and still have to hear his complaint made me think twice. Now I am still thinking of going for the amnio test , really scare of the worst outcome . Oh no this is really bothering me ....

Hi DollyLittleGal, I can understand how you feel. In fact I wasn't worried about risks of miscarriage until I hear comments from other mummies (who have never gone through it). But I eventually made the decision and went with it.

If you are really afraid of Amnio, then I'll suggest Harmony instead of the Genetic Scan because Harmony will pick out T21 if it exists. If the results come back normal, that's great. However if the result comes back abnormal, then Amnio is unavoidable. Harmony test is not cheap. KKH charges $800 (still cheaper than Genetic Scan), I'm not sure about SGH.

At the end of the day, you also need to know what are your decisions if the worst happens. Nonetheless, I've learned that a lot of results come back normal.

Like what Dr THH told me, my twin had a risk of 1:5 for T21, but he's not surprised with my amnio results because the twin has a 80% chance of being normal. So try to look on the bright side!
 


Hi milkcandy, Harmony test is also take our blood sample and send to US right . My gynae told me harmony test is not that accruate for twins as it is unable to determine which twin is affected. My T21 is 1:774 for T1 and 1:1000 for T2. Cut off is 1000 so I belong to intermediate risk, not low or high, hence amnio is recommended. Also I need to be poke twice for twins so the risk is 2% tog , haiz . Hubby suggested just go for it cos at least we can know the outcome accruately . I really hope I will be fine after the test . By the way, how did u take care yourself on the poking day and how many days u rested?? Just wanna mentally prepared and arrange for any help . Thanks
 

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