IVF-low ovarian reserve

thanks wb, very informative. guess you are right, didn't sleep well for the past few weeks. will try for it this month. hopefully my fsh can reduce.
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Hi wb, I am ok thanks! Now in 12th week..going to 13th this saturday. Just tired nowadays...

When is ur 2ww ending? Chin up ok... you will be fine! I will pray for you...
 
hi vanilla,

I feel happy for you, 12th week will be over soon.. your little baby will be much stronger there...

today is my BHcg test, unfortunately it is BFN
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we have tried what we could.. but everything are in God's hand..

my stomach feel pain today.. i guess AF will come soon..
anyway, feel happy can share our IVF journey with all ladies here..
 
v_ni,
thanks. i feel much better today.
it is better if you can do HSG. Good luck for today HSG!
I had very bad cramp after my HSG, then took panadol. luckily the next day no more pain.
 
wb, sorry to hear that. don't give up! ganbatte! don't mind sharing how times you've tried ivf?

van, happy for you! pls spread more babydust around.
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v_ni, good luck for your HSG!
 
Thanks ladies!

hi wb...sorry to hear that...but dont worry, God knows your wish to be a mummy and He listens to your prayers. It is all His timing and not ours, but not to worry, He will never be late!

Hi v_ni, how come ur gynae never suggest HSG first before embarking u on IVF? Are u in the IVF prgm already?

Hi Jenn..has been and will conrinue to pray for all the IVF ladies i meet in this forum! U take care too!
 
jenn, thanks. it was my 3rd IVF.
my first IVF : BFP with twins , loss them during my 7th-8th week.
2nd: fresh IVF+ FET : BFN
my right side tube is block , right ovary has 25% and left side has 50% , due to endometriosis.

vanilla, thanks. I guess we need to move on, probably adoption will be our next plan. or Who knows.. God will give thru natural process?
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v_ni, that's good.. at least you have few options . good luck for IUI.
 
hi wb, they can tell how many % is block? both my tubes are blocked, dunno how much, seems 100% coz can't even see any liquid. may be you can try clearing them 1st, and go for natural? that is what we think if ivf is not successful.

btw, i've started eating EPO & wheatgrass. is it alright that i take 15 tabs per day (ie. 5 tabs after every meal) since the instruction is 5 - 20 tabs per day?
 
hi jenn, my right side tube is block while the left side can see the liquid, not sure if there is any % for this kind of thing. I went through for years fighting on infertility problems, had 2x laparoscopy, 2x under clomid, 3x IVF , and i don't think will go for another painfull process... still not counting on how many time blood withdraws done or how many injections done..
for now, i will just move on.. enjoy life with dear hubby..
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if i can remember i read before, there is no harm on wheatgrass, if too many, you will see the "output" will be greenish.. :D so should be alright to take 15 tabs..
 
wb, oic. can understand the kind of painful process you've gone thru. really hope miracle happens. just stay positive.

thanks for the info. you're right, the result is very obvious, had green "output" just now.
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jenn, maybe you need to reduce it ? for me only take maximum 5 tabs per day.. there was one time took 10 tabs ..then come out greenish color
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Hi wb - was wondering if I could PM you on your experience - I think I have the same dr as you.

Hi Mngal - I am going to be posted to the United States in August for work and would probably continue IVF treatment there. You mentioned that you are considering a shared risk program. Is this one of the chains run by Sher Institute (SIRM)? I contacted SIRM via email recently on the diminished ovarian reserve and they suggested a different protocol to deal with this issue, using a combination of drugs which I have not seen in Singapore.
 
Priscilla
Which state will be posted to in US? I enquired about Sher Institute before I think one time, but they were super snoobish and expensive, plus they were not availbale in my state hence if I were to do it with them, I would have to travel to other cities, very inconvienient. Which protocol or drugs did they suggest to you?
 
Hi Mngal, I am going to be posted to New York City. The RE at SIRM suggested a form of mixed protocol in his email using a mix of lupron and cetrotide - I can email that to you. However, there were no specifics on the dosage stated. Actually, the protocol is also found in the book authored by Sher, which is sold on Amazon, and which is also the reason why I contacted them.

Your email address so that I can email to you? Yes, SIRM is super expensive. They have a shared risk program. Also I understand they push for immune testing and immune treatment, which will make it even more expensive. Plus they would need me to repeat all the tests; the costs of the testing there are astonishingly expensive, compared to the costs here. Each blood test on average costs 3 times over at SIRM, compared to here,even taking into account the fact that the Sing dollar has strengthened against the US dollar! On the other hand, they have a customised program for poor responders, so I am still debating.
 
Hi Priscilla
NYC is the ideal place to live on a short term basis. Full of fun and excitment, alot like Singapore. My email is [email protected]
Lupron is the suppressant. I have not heard of cetrotite, must be the stimulant. I think Dr Sher himself if based in Las Vegas.
It is interesting to find out that they have a protocol for poor responders, as far as I know, they doctors just increase the stimulant dosage and delay the suppressant stage. HOw did you even find out so much without paying them "Consultation fee"? I called them and the receptionist didnt even hand the call over to the doctors, she just told me to make an appointment! I have lost faith in getting treated here in US. So far, I only found clinics which sole intention is to make money.
 
Mngal - I spoke to SIRM RE on their discussion board. Cetrotide is an antagonist, used for short protocol. Actually, there is another protocols for poor responders. Some REs do natural cycle IVF - there are several REs in United States who specialise in this. New Hope, located in NYC, specialises in poor responders and they do natural cycle or low stm IVF. There is also St Lukes Hospital, in Missouri, that does mini-IVF, a form of low stm IVF. I heard that Cooper Centre in NJ is also good for poor responders. Natural cycle IVF is an expensive process because you need to do several times to have a reasonable prospect of success, so it is not always recommended. I find that dealing with service standards in many of these clinics in the United States a very challenging experience, even though they are supposedly very reputable, maybe partly because I am still in Singapore and have to schedule all these consults out of country. However, some of these REs have stellar reputations and they would have seen a lot more poor responders, so it might be worthwhile just making inquiries.
 
Hi Ladies

In my impression, from what i read from books and internet, FSH and Estradiol are not really curable or can be substantially lowered. Doctors dont have a cure or any ways to improve the levels. TCM might be able to but then again TCM only aim to nurture and tune all the hormones to be balanced. So if its a case of diminished egg reserve, even TCM may not help. My TCM doc also cannot guaranttee me that TCM can definitely improve FSH and E2 levels.

Its disheartening but so far thats what i heard and am slowly coming to terms with it. Just try my best but wont expect a great leap of improvement.

Am i wrong? Or you gals think FSH and E2 are curable? If curable, with what may i ask? Any drugs? Can share what your gynaes may have advised regarding high FSH?

Is there also basis that wheatgreass can lower FSH? Is it suitable for people with cold womb? Cos i read those with cold womb better not take. Any comments? Thanks!
 
Hi momobear,

I'm agree with you that there is no cure for ovaries reserve problem. how to cure for something that is going to "retire" soon?
But there is something to help to lower down the FSH level. we need to go back to the term why FSH level is important during IVF cycle.. as you are aware , during IVF process, we have injection of Puregon ,Gonal F or Menogon to produce more eggs.
These medicine is actually to increase "FSH" level. If our brain already produce so much FSH.. then this medicine will be wasted. It will no response at all. Then will end up with one egg which is the same as a "natural cycle".

TCM will be balancing the hormone, so when our ovaries does not response back , FSH will not produce more.

Based on my past history with the fertility specialists or gynae, they said.. it is our body, there is no way to lower down FSH level. It will no advice from Doc.

I searched from website and found out about the EPO ,wheatgrass and acupuncture that can lower down the FSH.
Before started my IVF cycle, i went for acupuncture, taking wheatgrass and EPO. and there was improvement on the FSH level. also improvement on how many follicles and eggs during stim.

I stopped EPO when started my Gonal F and only taking wheatgrass.
after Egg Collection I stopped taking wheatgrass too.

I guess for those with cold womb, still can take, but within the right dosage.

What do you think? May I know what is your FSH level?
 
Thanks Wb! Seeing your post about how wheatgrass can help improve FSH really comforts me. For at least now, i know there is one more thing i can try to do, at least try and hope the FSH gets better. Even if it doesnt get better, at the end of the day, at least i have tried my best.

Ok, shall go get some wheatgrass soon, GNC and pharmacies should sell rite? I reckon if i start taking now, 3 months later i may be able to do another blood test then decide if FSH ok to go on to another IVF.

My FSH was 7.5 in Nov 06 then 9.1 in Feb this year. I guess either its slowly retiring or my previous IVF may have stimulated too much and caused some unbalance? I also dont know.
 
Hi MomoBear,

Your FSH level is not that bad.. on Nov 07 my FSH level was 23 ! Then took the above suplements + acu, reduce to 13 then 10.

Yes, can find at GNC and pharmacies.
 
Hi ladies,

After taking wheatgrass, my FSH did reduce, from 18 to 16, still very high leh... dunno will it reduce further??
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Hi v ni,
a bit strange, you've done ivf, then now doing so-iui? i tot people usually do iui then followed by ivf.

anyway, i've not done any of them, so i presume follicle should be the bigger the merrier??
 
Hello,

I am new to singapore and am looking for a Fertility specialist who specializes in diminish egg reserve and high FSH. MY FSH levels are 50-60. Please help.
I have seen Dr Ann Tan, Dr julianah and will be seeing Dr LCwong.
 
Hi Ladies

Can I ask if any ladies here (under going IVF and has very good response and producing large qty of eggs) willing to donate your excess eggs to women who has poor ovarian reserve?

I think I may not be able to proceed to IVF using my own egg so I may need donor's egg.

Should you come across any kind soul who is willing to help, kindly PM me.

This could be my last Ray of Hope ........
 
Hi babytigers,

We met at the ivf support group thread. Would like to find out more about your experience with DHEA, but you do not accept pte message. Could you activate it?

Thanks.
 
Hi

Sorry for the boo boo.
I've made a mistake in the previous posting in this thread.
Should've posted in other IVF related thread.

I'm trying to find someone who is going thru IVF and is willing to assist by donating excess egg (subject to good response to the stimulation and good qty of eggs retrieve).

I think I've serious ovarian reserve issue which I dont think DHEA is able to help.
My previous 2 surgeries due to endometrosis had "injured" by ovaries ......

Is there anyway to find such egg donor in SG?

I've no siblings to donate to me, else I'll approach my sisters ........

Last ray of hope ........
 
this thread is so quiet now. i just failed my 2nd ivf and according to the doc, the failure is due to my low ovarian reserve and egg quality. despite taking 3 months of DHEA and visitng TMC for acup and taking chinese herbs, the end result did not get better. I was devasted when the doc told me tat the solution now is get donor eggs to boost my chance of conceiving. She says my eggs got 'worsen' thru the 1 year interval which i did the 2 ivfs. She suggested to get the donor eggs from malaysia... I broke down and cry, i am really sad and feel hopeless. Resigned from my job previously to concentrate on the ivf and this is wat i get. wat should i do now, i m already 36. i want to get a 2nd opinion, which doc shd i go to..
 
Dear babytigers,
When I had my 1st ivf failed, doc said he can't do anything for me, he also asked me to consider egg donor. I felt just like you, I dunno what to do then. My ovarian reserve is low too, I had done 2 lapo to remove cysts, I have endo and adenomyosis. But I never give up. I took DHEA for almost 9 mths, went TCM for acu and took the herbs for almost a year.
Finally, went for my 2nd ivf in July. with only 1 embryo available, I'm now preggy for 3 mths.
My previous gynae was from Thomson Medical, I switched to NUH subsequently. You may want to try Prof PC Wong, he's my gynae who did the ivf for me.
People at 40 still keep trying, just don't give up!
 
Jenn, thks for your encouragement! May i noe how old r u?I have not done any surgery like you did, i am also diagnosed with cycst and endo, but the doc never suggest me to go for op, maybe this could be hindering me all these while, i dunno.. My doc is quite neg prescribing me any more DHEA and i also dun like the idea of taking it anymore as i hv side effects like dropping more hair (do u?). May i ask which TCM u visited, i went to the one at AMK, heard that the sinseh is good. tat pt in time i perservere to see her regularly even i stay at the East and taking the herbs no matter how awful it taste. Now tat all have gone to a waste, i feel v discouraged, thinking i have to see her again really put me off due to the travelling dist.
can i ask does NUH provide govt co-funding for ivf? How do i go to get the 1st appt to see Prof PC Wong? At first i thot of Loh SF from KK. really vex now..
 
Hi babytigers,
I'm 1 yr older than u. I went to Dr Zuo at AMK, guess it's the same TCM u visited. I see her twice a week and I stayed in the west. I think it depends on how much u really want to get pregnant. Which gynae did you see previously? Is it SF Loh? I feel that NUH has better service than KK, but it's more ex lor.
And yes, there is govt subsidy. Just call the hot line and make appt with him. He specialises in ivf.
 
Jenn, i was with SGH, Dr Yu SL. both my ivfs are short protocol. I thot of getting 2nd opinion from Loh SF from KK since so many girls here go to him for IVF. Other than DHEA and TMC, do you take other supplements or do anything to boost up your chance?
 
I took multi-vit and fish oil. I think SF Loh has too many patients. btw what is your bmi? I used to be overweight, my bmi is around 27. I read in a website that bmi below 25 has higher chance to succeed in ivf. I took about 6 mths to slim down to bmi 23, before my ivf.
 
my bmi ard 23. yes i do agree tat overweight will lower the chance of conceiving. now tat u r 3 months pregnant, really congrates to u. u must be over the moon when u noe u r pregnant. can i check how much do you pay for the consultation with Prof Wong, is he good?
 
Ya, I thank god for making all these happen. It's not easy. Prof Wong is the most senior consultant there, his consultation fee is around $80.
 
dear sisters,
hopefully my story will bring some hope to you
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as i am a very busy sahm now so pardon me for borrowing my own post ( posted in may 2007 after i tested bfp ) :


i have been a silent reader all this while cos i consider myself to be a failure and my story can be quite demoralizing for gals who are embarking in this ivf journey but finally after 4 fresh n 1 fet , i have finally make it, i am pregnant, its really a miracle!
we have spent so much $ seeing doc ( like chris chen, prof ng, sheila loh, noel leong and finally sf loh who made my dream come true), goin thru lapo and hysteroscopy and countless tcm (i mus thank tan siew bouy of thong chai for taking care of me during this period).
this is my 1st ivf with sf loh, he has been very pro, + and encouraging, he pity me for going thru so much! i proposed to sf to use a diff propotocol(this is more common in uk) this time cos i have been a poor responder( with very high dosage like 600 puregon or 450 gonal f) although each time i have 3 good quality embies to et but no implantaion ( this could be due to my adenomyosis). this time, i tried natural ivf with no stimulation at all, it really depends on my body, so they retrive whatever foolicles they can find during my o and icsi. the day before my er, i kena food poisoning , fever of 38.3 but i refused to tk any med n drank glucose water. the next day sf retrieve 3 follicles ( 1 mature n 2 immature, i mus thank tsb's herbs, i am taking her herbs throughout this period) so in the end they transfeered 1 embryo, we were grateful, we were prepared that there might not be any to et at all. btw, the 1st ivf bb brown in the world was also conceived using this method.i am grateful that sf is receptive to my suggestion cos not many docs in sin are as receptive as him.
according to my hb who was with me during et, he noticed sf put the cathether much deeper than my precious cycles with other docs. moreover, i din have a full bladder that day, mayb nt even half cos based on my previous exp, i always rushed for the toilet aft et n reading from the postings i understand sf is able to et wihtout a full baldder so i decided to go without full bladder. when sis phua scan me, she said, hw come don hv full bladder , go drink more water but sf quickly said , its ok! amazing, it was a breeze, i only go to the loo two hours later when i was at home. but the next day while i was taking a nap, i felt a sharp pull below my belly button then when i go to the loo, i saw a red stain on my panty, size of a 50cent coin so i thot to myself this time gone liao cos its too early to be impantation bleed. luckily next day, it had stopped. this time round , i tk things pretty easy, mayb because without the stimulation drugs so my mood is much better.

so for those who had failed, pls do not give, look at me, i quit my job, 5yrs ago to ttc and i m not young, 36 this year, i have come a long way but i din give up. i still don believe , i have crossed the 1st hurdle of receivng my miracle bb. i still have a long way to go , the next 9 mths is crucial to me, so pls don gv up!
 
it was not a easy journey even during my 9mths of pegnancy. we really thank dr loh and dr tan siew bouy ( tsb)for taking great care of me. i started spotting ard week 8 ( brown spotting) and since then dr loh had been seeing me on a weekly basis despite his super busy schedule. my hb always joke i am wasting kkh's valuable resources. at week 10 i started spotting again , this time round it happened ard midnite and it was brigh red, i almost fainted n i thought to myself , gone ! dr loh tried his best n gave me the necessary treatment. dr tsb oso gv me more herbs to take on a daily basis.
after things stabilized after the 1st trimester did dr loh ask me if i would like to see him every 2 weeks n subsequently 3weeks. we were really touched by his thoughtful gestures.
i was admitted to kkh ard week 33 due to food poisoning and after 1 week of hospitalization i was ready to be discharge but just the morning before i was schedule to discharge i felt constant constipation pain without realizing i was in labor till i started spotting and i delivered that very day
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my miracle baby was very small at 2.3kg but he is a very happy and healthy boy now after all the episodes. when we look at him we do not regret our decision in persevering. So please do not give up!

Anyway I believe every doctor is good in their own way but we just need to find 1 whom we are comfortable with. That was the reason i have been doctor "hopping" and we were glad we found them
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hi miracle, its really a miracle!! Your story is so motivating to me. May i noe it took you how how to concieve after u quit from your job? i too resigned from my job to focus on ivf but my eggs turned out to be lesser n of lower quality as compared to the 1st ivf. dunno izzit due to the stress/financial stress tat i stayed at home n resulted in the poor response of my eggs. now tat i hv failed my 2nd ivf n jobless, i really dunno wat to do now. feel so down n useless for acheiving nothing during my jobless period. no income n no baby. look for a job also diff as once the employer noes i quit my previous job due to family planning, they r hesitant to hire me as they scared i will get preg anytime after i joined them n they also doubt whether i can take on any stress as i m trying to concieve, really sickening.

i thot of switching to sf loh but he's v popular, dunno got to wait long to see him for first appt. so is your kid 3 years old alrady ?
 
hi babytigers,

dont be disheartened. i quitted ard 2004 and conceived in 2007. dont stress yourself over this, these are just numbers. how old are you?

yes my son is turning 3 end of the year.

you do not have to elaborate your reason for quitting , just state u quit becos of family/personal matters. most impt put in your best during the interview.

i realized most people conceived when they are least stress. Most important you must stay happy, positive and keep yourself occupy. during the few years, i meet up with friends regularly, volunteer to tutor kids from less privilege households and yoga.

if $ is an issue maybe you can consider freelance, part time work or full time work? the last thing you want is to worry about money while ttcing. maybe find a less stressful job with regular hours?

are you seeing any tcm seinseh? i have seen many sinsehs but it seemed dr tsb's herbs suited me better. i noticed my health improved after 3-4mths.

no harm calling kkh and you may decide from there
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good luck !
 
miracle

yes, tell u frankly i am Really disheartened. I m already 36, tried 3 iui n 2 ivfs, but none make it. and now the doc told me to get donor eggs which left me even more distraught. maybe i should let go things. during my jobless period, i cant say tat i m really happy, i worry abt no job n also what if ivf fail, feeling detached from the outside world etc.. i worry abt many things, do you? i stay with my inlaws n his siblings and we have a maid, so basically i dun have to do any hsework at all, this make me feel even more useless , like everyone is working except me n all envy me tat i can go without a job to concentrate on this but actually i dun feel happy.. really contradicting correct? actually i really hope i can conceive when i m working n able to enjoy the paid maternity leave, tat is the most ideal to me. i quitted previously from my job is due to the long hours.

i visited the chinese sinseh at amk, Dr Zou. After the failed ivf, i stopped. Reason being the travelling dist and disappointment. I m not seeing one right now. the one u mentioned also long queue izzit ? i also seen before the one at marine parade, near to parkway n the famous jurong east sinseh.

Our financial is still manageable n my hubby did not really rush me to find a job after i failed the 2nd ivf.He just wan me to find something to do tat can make myself busy n useful n not keep thinking tat i cant contribute anything.

Dun noe m i in my mid career crisis now, i dun have the passion to go back to my old line, i thot of switching to teaching young children, but cert is needed inorder to teach which puts me off as taking up the course = need to spend money which i have already spent so much on the treatment. really vex.
 
babytigers,

during my first appointment dr sheila loh of kkh ( currently heading ivf in raffles), the 1st option she gave me was " adoption" and i cant control myself and cried in front of her
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i was terribly upset but i told myself i m going to keep trying till i succeed.

i have seen the sinsehs at marine parade and the jurong east sinseh too but their herbs were not suitable for me. actually i m consider an impossible case because my adenomyosis is situated at the area which will affect implantation so i am very grateful to dr tsb for treating my adeno and managed to shrunk it and helped in implantation. every time i went for scan during my ivf , all the sonographers will comment never see anyone with adeno as bad as mine and manage to conceive. i was rather upset but my desire to have a baby was so strong i persevere and keep myself occupied .
anyway i just pm u.
 


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